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 The Book of Wisdom on the plot against Jesus

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Sansanoy



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PostSubject: The Book of Wisdom on the plot against Jesus    Sat May 27, 2017 11:46 am

I thought this was really interesting. The book of Wisdom used to be part of the Jewish cannon and was contained in the Septuagint. It is no longer part of Jewish cannon, along with several other books. The book dates from 75BC to 40AD. There is a prophecy of Jesus in it which I'll quote below. The prophecy is from the perspective of the Jews who crucified him, so read it from that perspective and it will make a lot more sense.

1 For they have said, reasoning with themselves, but not right: The time of our life is short and tedious, and in the end of a man there is no remedy, and no man hath been known to have returned from hell:
2 For we are born of nothing, and after this we shall be as if we had not been: for the breath in our nostrils is smoke: and speech a spark to move our heart,
3 Which being put out, our body shall be ashes, and our spirit shall be poured abroad as soft air, and our life shall pass away as the trace of a cloud, and shall be dispersed as a mist, which is driven away by the beams of the sun, and overpowered with the heat thereof:
4 And our name in time shall be forgotten, and no man shall have any remembrance of our works.
5 For our time is as the passing of a shadow, and there is no going back of our end: for it is fast sealed, and no man returneth.
6 Come therefore, and let us enjoy the good things that are present, and let us speedily use the creatures as in youth.
7 Let us fill ourselves with costly wine, and ointments: and let not the flower of the time pass by us.
8 Let us crown ourselves with roses, before they be withered: let no meadow escape our riot.
9 Let none of us go without his part in luxury: let us everywhere leave tokens of joy: for this is our portion, and this our lot.
10 Let us oppress the poor just man, and not spare the widow, nor honour the ancient grey hairs of the aged.
11 But let our strength be the law of justice: for that which is feeble, is found to be nothing worth.
12 Let us therefore lie in wait for the just, because he is not for our turn, and he is contrary to our doings, and upbraideth us with transgressions of the law, and divulgeth against us the sins of our way of life.
13 He boasteth that he hath the knowledge of God, and calleth himself the son of God.
14 He is become a censurer of our thoughts.
15 He is grievous unto us, even to behold: for his life is not like other men's, and his ways are very different.
16 We are esteemed by him as triflers, and he abstaineth from our ways as from filthiness, and he preferreth the latter end of the just, and glorieth that he hath God for his father.
17 Let us see then if his words be true, and let us prove what shall happen to him, and we shall know what his end shall be.
18 For if he be the true son of God, he will defend him, and will deliver him from the hands of his enemies.
19 Let us examine him by outrages and tortures, that we may know his meekness and try his patience.
20 Let us condemn him to a most shameful death: for there shall be respect had unto him by his words.
21 These things they thought, and were deceived: for their own malice blinded them.
22 And they knew not the secrets of God, nor hoped for the wages of justice, nor esteemed the honour of holy souls.
23 For God created man incorruptible, and to the image of his own likeness he made him.
24 But by the envy of the devil, death came into the world:
25 And they follow him that are of his side.

There are a lot of books that the Bible draws content from, quotes directly or explicitly mentions that are not in the cannon of the Bible. However I still believe in the cannon and the guidance of it through the centuries. I wonder if the way to view it is to see the cannon as the God's shaping of the future of the world. For example we know that Israel as a nation is suffering from blindness. While that may be spiritual blindness it's also a physical blindness as we witness the changing of cannon and scripture as it shifted from the Septuagint to the Masoretic text. We also have an expectation that Israel will recover the truth and their cannon and source texts will change once more. As outsiders I guess it's easier to see that happening to another group. But I often wonder if we are not under a lesser blindness through our cannon for we know a great deception is coming for us as well. Not that we should resist the cannon, but that we should always be ready to respond to the urging of God, just as those fathers did who formed the cannon which shaped the future.

Here I have in mind the Book of Enoch. I have been wondering for a while now if God  has not caused amnesia for a time regarding the giants and the book of Enoch.  The book itself is not for the generations of the past but for the generations of the tribulation. Just as the Israelites became blind to Jesus for a time until the future, what if a different blindness is also ours for a future time?

The time period in which the giants fell out of favor to the church fathers was also the beginnings of the skeptical age, where spiritual gifts diminished, the oracles of demons ceased, and hard evidence was required for every thought. The old world was exhausted of it's gigantic evidence. What trials would have awaited the Church if it wasn't for the Sethite theory born from the loss of books like Enoch. How much worse would the Church have fared against Bertrand Russel and waves of Atheistic thought?

Lately I just strongly feel like the cannon is alive and changing according to Gods plan for the future. Maybe just like Israel the Church will return to what we lost in the past to respond to a new and developing future. I think this is what is happening now. When I was in high school no one even mentioned Enoch, but, now nearly 2 decades later  I am witnessing more and more Christians become open to it's content. I think God is returning what has been lost to prepare us for a new age.
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michael371



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PostSubject: Re: The Book of Wisdom on the plot against Jesus    Sat May 27, 2017 12:22 pm

aha!!!   another man after my own heart....as soon as i have time, i am going to check out the book of wisdom....very interesting.....thank you
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Sansanoy



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PostSubject: Re: The Book of Wisdom on the plot against Jesus    Sat May 27, 2017 12:34 pm

Glad to hear I'm not alone in my thoughts.
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michael371



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PostSubject: Re: The Book of Wisdom on the plot against Jesus    Sat May 27, 2017 1:14 pm

no, this is a somewhat unconventional forum, and you are not alone.....more people read rather than post and,hopefully, we are about to rev things up......spring 2 and colonel z keep us up to date on news and happenings and a bunch of real interesting stuff.....

now, i just read a little, and skimmed over the book of wisdom and as soon as i get some free time, i am going to look at it a lot more closely....just as a first impression, based on a little bit of reading various parts from top to bottom, it APPEARS that this book fits the cannon.....i see nothing that would indicate that it did not meet the straight line of scrutiny required....sans, there is a reason that jasher,enoch,jubilees,etc are not in the bible, and its not that they do not meet the criteria of the church fathers....its because they reveal things that some did not want others to know....keep looking
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PostSubject: Re: The Book of Wisdom on the plot against Jesus    Sat May 27, 2017 1:34 pm

Sansanoy wrote:
Glad to hear I'm not alone in my thoughts.

HA! Not on this forum. We've been digging into books not in the "official approved" cannon for years. I uploaded the Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha by R.H. Charles along with other woks back in 2011 to my Mediafire cloud file sharing site. Link below goes to a folder containing 6 files. Screenshot below of what is inside that folder. Y'all download it if you like. Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha is pretty extensive at around 2000-ish pages. The paper version is available on Amazon and other places too.

https://www.mediafire.com/folder/gxaqg423tptxc/Apocrypha_and_Pseudepigrapha



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Josephus

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PostSubject: Re: The Book of Wisdom on the plot against Jesus    Sat May 27, 2017 1:54 pm

Thanks researcher! I have some of these, Thanks to Mike!, but not all of them yet. I'm still trying to get caught up on all of them.

One thing that is really curious to me. You mention the "officially approved." The Coptic Christians (mostly seen in Egypt, I think) are one of the oldest sects in Christianity. They have continuously kept the Book of Enoch in their cannon, while said book has been in and out of other cannons. Makes one wonder why and what exactly is disagreed with that people don't want us to see?
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PostSubject: Re: The Book of Wisdom on the plot against Jesus    Sat May 27, 2017 2:13 pm

Josephus wrote:
Thanks researcher! I have some of these, Thanks to Mike!, but not all of them yet. I'm still trying to get caught up on all of them.

One thing that is really curious to me. You mention the "officially approved." The Coptic Christians (mostly seen in Egypt, I think) are one of the oldest sects in Christianity. They have continuously kept the Book of Enoch in their cannon, while said book has been in and out of other cannons. Makes one wonder why and what exactly is disagreed with that people don't want us to see?
study them.....you'll see......you might want to check out the septuagint, also....i'll give you a hint, josey, ole buddy, go read ecclesiastes 1 and take a look around you in the "scientific and technological world".....its all been done before and caused a little problem that ended in some heavy rainfall for around 40 days
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Sansanoy



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PostSubject: Re: The Book of Wisdom on the plot against Jesus    Sat May 27, 2017 3:32 pm

researcher wrote:
Sansanoy wrote:
Glad to hear I'm not alone in my thoughts.

HA! Not on this forum. We've been digging into books not in the "official approved" cannon for years. I uploaded the Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha by R.H. Charles along with other woks back in 2011 to my Mediafire cloud file sharing site. Link below goes to a folder containing 6 files. Screenshot below of what is inside that folder. Y'all download it if you like. Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha is pretty extensive at around 2000-ish pages. The paper version is available on Amazon and other places too.

https://www.mediafire.com/folder/gxaqg423tptxc/Apocrypha_and_Pseudepigrapha

Thanks, added it to my bookmarks. I actually used to own a hardcover Apocyrpha. My wife was making a run to good will and she stacked all my books up and had me sort them. I had books on catholic exorcism stuff, Enuma Elish, Morning of the Magicians, A cops guide to the occult (or something like that. It was a guide on how to recognize people in the occult, and what they belong too). She took the wrong stuff and sent a whole stack of weird stuff straight to goodwill. I feel so sorry for the people that go book shopping there lol.
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PostSubject: Re: The Book of Wisdom on the plot against Jesus    Sat May 27, 2017 3:46 pm

Joesephus wrote:
You mention the "officially approved."


I'm referring to the 3rd, 4th, 5th centuries when it was being hashed out by church fathers, counsel of Nicaea, Constantine's commission at Constantinople etc. It was decided what would stay and what would go and many good books like Enoch weren't invited to the party, though in a few rare places like the Ethiopian cannon Enoch was never cut out. By the end of the 5th century the books were pretty much decided upon and then came . . . . .

The Roman Catholic church, the dark ages, the vicars, the popes, that MARY thing, yadda yadda and even more yadda, and a further slide downward on the greasy pole, and as they say, "the rest is history". Now I've asked myself many times, "self, just what were/are they trying to hide from us"? I smell agenda and it smells pretty foul indeed.

If that's unsettling, well, just have a look-see at the UNHOLY SEE today, you know, that mess we all call the Vatican! There's been some serious spiritual hanky-panky going on here and the DEVIL is in the details. Same goes for the so-called church today as well as most of it is nothing but a bunch of protesting (protestant) Catholics. Not meaning to run Catholics down here however the thing is what it is. Lots of Catholics believe the gospel and are saved and I'm glad of that.

That's my own personal view after many-a-ponder on the topic. Your mileage may vary.


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It is difficult to get a man to understand something . . .
. . . when his salary depends on his not understanding it.


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