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 Who Are the Elect?

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murray leslie
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PostSubject: Who Are the Elect?   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 07, 2015 11:09 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Who Are the Elect?   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 08, 2015 10:34 pm

All who believe that Jesus Christ is Lord , who died and rose again from the grave to pay for our sins.
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PostSubject: Re: Who Are the Elect?   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 09, 2015 12:59 am

I think there will be a lot of surprise among those who believe they are part of "the elect." There are any number of "false converts" within the American church today, those who have said the magic words about accepting Jesus as their Savior, but not as their Lord, in the sense of obeying His commandments and totally surrendering their lives to Him.  Those words are merely a fire insurance policy for too many. Remember those passages about those to whom the Lord says, "Depart, I never knew you."

That should be enough to inspire all of us with the fear of God and a desire to be overcomers, living as close to Him as possible. Sadly, today health, wealth and prosperity is the real god for many - not the Jesus who says to pick up our crosses and follow Him.
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murray leslie

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PostSubject: Re: Who Are the Elect?   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 09, 2015 9:18 am

Jesus calls abe, because he believed God, and all those to follow, to Christ, and since, those who believe on Him, (Jesus) His brethren, everyone else is ded...then @ the white throne, the ded r raised and judged by how they treated His brethren...see: separation of sheep and goats, simple eh?
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PostSubject: Re: Who Are the Elect?   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 09, 2015 9:59 am

I think Dr, Rita nailed it with murray leslie coming in a close second by a nose.


Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven

!! FOXTROT JULIET BRAVO !!
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PostSubject: Re: Who Are the Elect?   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 09, 2015 10:15 am


No  Sorry, I don't agree.

Quote :

"What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?

Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect? And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God. Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way? For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also."  James 2:14-26
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murray leslie

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PostSubject: Re: Who Are the Elect?   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 09, 2015 3:15 pm

pil, faith in God give you eternal life, the presence of the Holy spirit causes works, everything else is ded... i'm no.2...i'm no.2 cheers
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PostSubject: Re: Who Are the Elect?   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 09, 2015 4:48 pm

I'd say you're No. 1 since with your explanation of how we treat the children of Abraham, you're closer to what James describes than the others who wrote comments (myself excepted).  So much for modesty!
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PostSubject: Re: Who Are the Elect?   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 09, 2015 5:27 pm

Well, if the children of Abraham are the elect and the rest of us "wild branches" are grafted into the Hebrew's olive tree then doesn't that make us all part of the elect? You believed the gospel message and accepted Yeshua as the substitute knowing that He took our sins punishment, something that we could never do on our own. We've been adopted (grafted) into Abraham's family (olive tree). I still say that Dr. Rita nailed it.

Better re-read Romans chapters 9 thru 11 if ya need a refresher course on this.


Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven

!! FOXTROT JULIET BRAVO !!
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PostSubject: Re: Who Are the Elect?   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 09, 2015 5:40 pm

All I'm saying is that professing faith in Christ is not enough... it takes works as well, to prove that commitment, since even the demons believe and tremble.  There's too many today who could be called Laodicean, who accept Christ by saying a "salvation prayer" and then focus on the Joel Osteen gospel of being healthy and wealthy instead of picking up their cross and following Jesus, committing all to Him, regardless of the cost - especially in America.  It takes more than a profession of belief - it takes discipleship.  Watch this video for examples:


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PostSubject: Re: Who Are the Elect?   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 09, 2015 7:56 pm

If it takes works as well, what about the murderer on the cross!
( I didn't really want to bring this up)but...... There are lots of people who probably died, after accepting Christ, who did not have time to do "works" Roman Catholics sincerely believe this, but they are sincerely wrong!
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PostSubject: Re: Who Are the Elect?   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 09, 2015 8:23 pm

Obviously the thief on the cross didn't have to prove his sincerity by works... he didn't have time. But for those of us who do, discipleship is the key.  It isn't enough to say you believe, you have to demonstrate that through your obedience to the Word, as James makes clear.  There are too many Laodicean Christians in America today who have said a sinners prayer as fire insurance, then go on living as they always have, fulfilling the lusts of the flesh, justifying anything they choose to do, and still believing they're on their way to heaven because they've made that confession.  Sorry, but I believe that they're the ones to whom Christ will say, "Depart from me, I never knew you."
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PostSubject: Re: Who Are the Elect?   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 09, 2015 10:56 pm

As for works, we all have choices to make every single day. To my mind, those are our works.

The two branches, the Church and the Jews, coming together. Imagine that.

Pray that we're found worthy.
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murray leslie

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PostSubject: Re: Who Are the Elect?   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 10, 2015 9:15 am

worthy to escape the things coming on this world...lk21:36

pil, i think the people who use His name, but deny He is their God & King, dont know Him...
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PostSubject: Assurance of Salvation   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 10, 2015 11:28 am

I wanted to share an article with the group as this thread is working through among other things, wheat and chafe, those that are a new creation and election.
The article is from John Piper, and while I may not agree with everything that Dr. Piper has written, I thought of this article when I was reading this thread.
Link:
http://www.desiringgod.org/articles/the-agonizing-problem-of-the-assurance-of-salvation

In Him,
J
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PostSubject: the elect   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 18, 2015 4:17 pm

*... well, i'm gonna jump on in here w/out having the benefit of reading all the material on this post.  but, i'll say this:  who are the elect? ...all who call upon the name of Jesus Christ as Saviour, receiving his everlasting salvation of grace, by faith alone, and even that is a gift of God, (...even if we do have a choice to receive it or not) we continue to receive it, again by said faith alone, and we who conclude this spiritual journey by continuing to live and eventually die in that self- same faith, simple faith, trusting God alone to save us from start to finish, and all points in between!  those who do that are the elect.  jew or gentile, it makes no difference.  the same conditions apply to both groups.  the jew is not under a different covenant than the gentile, or visa/versa.  faith in Jesus and his shed blood.  it's that simple...



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PostSubject: faith & mo' faith...   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 18, 2015 4:22 pm

*... this is what is referred to in scripture (Rom. chapter 1) as the 'obedience of faith'...

Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, set apart for the gospel of God which he promised beforehand through his prophets in the holy scriptures, the gospel concerning his Son, who was descended from David according to the flesh and designated Son of God in power according to the Spirit of holiness by his resurrection from the dead, Jesus Christ our Lord,through whom we have received grace and apostleship to bring about the obedience of faith for the sake of his name among all the nations, including yourselves who are called to belong to Jesus Christ...   Cool
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PostSubject: the creeds   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 18, 2015 4:39 pm

*... oh yeah, as part of that 'obedience of faith', one must sincerely believe what is listed in the creeds...


I believe in God, the Father Almighty, Creator of Heaven and earth; 
and in Jesus Christ, His only [begotten] Son Our Lord, 
Who was conceived by the Holy Spirit, born of the Virgin Mary, suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, died, and was buried. 
He descended into Hell; the third day He rose again from the dead; 
He ascended into Heaven, and sitteth at the right hand of God, the Father almighty; from thence He shall come to judge the living and the dead.  I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy Christian Church, the communion of saints, the forgiveness of sins, the resurrection of the body and life everlasting...  Amen.


*... and also:


I believe in one God, the Father Almighty, maker of heaven and earth and of all things visible and invisible.  And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of His Father before all worlds, God of God, Light of Light, very God of very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father, by whom all things were made; who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven and was incarnate by the Holy Spirit of the virgin Mary and was made man; and was crucified also for us under Pontius Pilate.  He suffered and was buried.  And the third day He rose again according to the Scriptures and ascended into heaven and sits at the right hand of the Father.  And He will come again with glory to judge both the living and the dead, whose kingdom will have no end.  And I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord and giver of life, who proceeds from the Father and the Son, who with the Father and the Son together is worshiped and glorified, who spoke by the prophets.  And I believe in one holy Christian and apostolic Church.  I acknowledge one Baptism for the remission of sins, and I look for the resurrection of the dead and the life of the world to come...  Amen!

*...you do that in sincere faith and grace, received from God, and continue therein, you'll be in good shape!    Wink



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PostSubject: another creed...   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 18, 2015 5:11 pm

*... one last creed is most helpful as well as to what constitutes the very 'elect'...

Whosoever will be saved, before all things it is necessary that he hold the christian faith. Which faith except every one do keep whole and undefiled; without doubt he shall perish everlastingly. And the christian faith is this: That we worship one God in Trinity, and Trinity in Unity; Neither confounding the Persons; nor dividing the Essence. For there is one Person of the Father; another of the Son; and another of the Holy Spirit. But the Godhead of the Father, of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, is all one; the Glory equal, the Majesty coeternal. Such as the Father is; such is the Son; and such is the Holy Spirit. The Father uncreated; the Son uncreated; and the Holy Spirit uncreated. The Father unlimited; the Son unlimited; and the Holy Spirit unlimited. The Father eternal; the Son eternal; and the Holy Spirit eternal. And yet they are not three eternals; but one eternal. As also there are not three uncreated; nor three infinites, but one uncreated; and one infinite. So likewise the Father is Almighty; the Son Almighty; and the Holy Spirit Almighty. And yet they are not three Almighties; but one Almighty. So the Father is God; the Son is God; and the Holy Spirit is God. And yet they are not three Gods; but one God. So likewise the Father is Lord; the Son Lord; and the Holy Spirit Lord. And yet not three Lords; but one Lord. For like as we are compelled by the Christian Verity; to acknowledge every Person by himself to be God and Lord; So are we forbidden by the christian religion; to say, There are three Gods, or three Lords. The Father is made of none; neither created, nor begotten. The Son is of the Father alone; not made, nor created; but begotten. The Holy Spirit is of the Father and of the Son; neither made, nor created, nor begotten; but proceeding. So there is one Father, not three Fathers; one Son, not three Sons; one Holy Spirit, not three Holy Spirits. And in this Trinity none is before, or after another; none is greater, or less than another. But the whole three Persons are coeternal, and coequal. So that in all things, as aforesaid; the Unity in Trinity, and the Trinity in Unity, is to be worshipped. He therefore that will be saved, let him thus think of the Trinity...
Furthermore it is necessary to everlasting salvation; that he also believe faithfully the Incarnation of our Lord Jesus Christ. For the right Faith is, that we believe and confess; that our Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, is God and Man; God, of the Essence of the Father; begotten before the worlds; and Man, of the Essence of his Mother, born in the world. Perfect God; and perfect Man, of a reasonable soul and human flesh subsisting. Equal to the Father, as touching his Godhead; and inferior to the Father as touching his Manhood. Who although he is God and Man; yet he is not two, but one Christ. One; not by conversion of the Godhead into flesh; but by assumption of the Manhood by God. One altogether; not by confusion of Essence; but by unity of Person. For as the reasonable soul and flesh is one man; so God and Man is one Christ; Who suffered for our salvation; descended into hell; rose again the third day from the dead. He ascended into heaven, he sitteth on the right hand of the God the Father Almighty, from whence he will come to judge the living and the dead. At whose coming all men will rise again with their bodies; And shall give account for their own works. And they that have done good shall go into life everlasting; and they that have done evil, into everlasting fire. This is the christian faith; which except a man believe truly and firmly, he cannot be saved...

*... our 'good work' here is to believe sincerely on the Lord Jesus Christ!  to reject this is the ultimate 'evil work'...   study
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PostSubject: Re: Who Are the Elect?   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeSat Dec 26, 2015 10:07 pm

Your faith is evinced by your works (Internet Pilgrim - James 2:14), faith without works is dead.
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PostSubject: faith vs. wrks...   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 31, 2015 1:50 pm

*... nope CHB, that's simply not the case, as evidenced via the scripture below:


Ephesians 2:8-10...

8. For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God -- 9. not because of works, lest any man should boast. 10. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them...


*... salvation is gift.  it is not 'proved' by works.  indeed, good works are a part of the christian life, but, in the order as outlined by st. Paul.  


*... a careful reading of the book of Romans, chapters 3-5 will more than adequately bear this out as well...  


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PostSubject: a thank you gift...   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 31, 2015 2:19 pm

*... note, the grace and the faith to receive said eternal salvation is correctly identified as a gift as well.  it's all a gift of God, start to finish! 

8. For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God -- 9. not because of works, lest any man should boast. 10. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them...   Cool
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PostSubject: Re: Who Are the Elect?   Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 31, 2015 6:23 pm

We are not saved by works, but by faith in the work of Christ... but we give evidence of that faith through works.  They complement one another, and without works, faith is meaningless, for even the demons believe and tremble... but our works are evidence of our faith.
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PostSubject: ...'work' it out man!    Who Are the Elect? I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 04, 2016 3:20 pm

*... indeed, we are saved by grace through faith alone!  we are not save by good works, but rather, for good works.  ...the good works still get 'done'.  i approach any 'good' works manifest in my life from a stance of already having been made righteous by God's grace, made effective through faith alone, ...apart from works!  i do not prove the authenticity of my faith via works.  that would be a self-righteous gesture, and therefore, unacceptable to God.  i rely on, and completely trust in the finished work of Jesus Christ.  i am a new creation in Him.  that is the crux of my acceptableness to God.  good works come naturally and are a 'fruit' of my recreated, regenerated spirit-man, the new man in Christ Jesus, an already extant reality in and of my true being.  i rest in Him.  now, i can turn my back on this rested faith and apostatize, thus falling away into perdition.  the scriptures bear this fact out quite plainly.  so, i stay in saving faith, by continued trust in Christ, and His shed blood alone...   Cool
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