The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Sun Oct 30, 2022 11:23 am

I just ran into a glitch on Biblegateway on an Authorized Version search. Notice the word Faith. It's never read "faith". It should read 'faithfulness'.
--
I could argue there is quite the difference there.
The New King James has the traditional AV verses.

Galatians 5:22-23 AVKJ
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, 23 meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
-----
Galatians 5:22-23
New King James Version

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 [a]gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.
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I wanted to de-mystify walking in the Spirit somewhat, with an easy example.
Let's say we're in the middle of a food shortage. You have 2 loaves because you studied and knew what was coming, but your neighbor did not know and has no bread.
And he comes to your door, begging bread. (You recall the story Wink

)
-------
One who walks by the flesh has an immediate dilemma. 'I only have 2 left and mouths to feed, what will I do if I run out?
Let's make it harder. The neighbor is a New Ager, joyfully waiting on the aliens.
The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 1f609

The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 1f609

The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 1f604

Now what? You give, because you're tempered by the Word and the Word says so. You give as you give to the Lord!!!
Not begrudgingly, because there's no reward in that.
Not judgmentally, because we are not to judge.
And that is well.
-----
But, there's more!
There is another level of understanding that comes from the Spirit who reminds us of all Jesus said, and also reveals the Kingdom to us through knowledge, wisdom, revelation, (when the lightbulb goes off) and understanding, as He teaches us the Nature of God and His Kingdom. God is a Good and Joyful giver.
In Him there is no lack, no dry wells. He is the Source of ALL abundance.
As we give to others, He pours out on us to meet our needs and More. God is Abundance of all good things!
And that is Faith that passes all understanding and comes from within us by the Spirit.

It's a mistake if we think what we give belongs to us.
We become an instrument of His Will. (that none shall perish, but all come to know Him)

AND there's more.
IF the Spirit is our Life, then He arranged it all, for His Purpose,
whatever that might be. We are not to weigh that out. We just 'do'.
He is our Teacher. He likes to walk us through lessons, so we KNOW, and not just know about them. But He WILL bring us through them all. The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 1f60a

The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 1f60a

So, have Faith.

John 13:34, “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another.” He continues, “By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another”

Maybe some of the New Agers got something right. The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 2764

The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 2764

For the UFO'ers, maybe Paul's address to the Greeks. The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 1f609

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Mon Oct 31, 2022 1:52 pm

I wondered if somewhere in your reading someone came across a 'teaching' of the seven heavens. Summaries work for me. Maybe Heiser?

Question 2. When the Bible talks about the renewed earth, is it renewed or new (as in somewhere else?)

Only if you're interested, or may already know, of course. Otherwise, I'll try to get to it. Wink

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Mon Oct 31, 2022 4:12 pm

Here's an article on the Seven Spirits of God

https://www.crosswalk.com/faith/bible-study/what-are-the-seven-spirits-of-god.html

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

Dove.......When you bring up the seven heavens this will take us out of The Bible. It will lead us into many different ancient text and religions. 2 Enoch is a book I've read and it tells of ten heavens.

Right from the start I'm going to say........"Take any of this material with a grain of salt." If I study a subject I study it to attempt to understand "Many beliefs" and where it all comes from".

The only mention of one of the heavens in the Bible other than just the heavens is in 2 Corinthians. Paul here mentions the third heaven which he says is Paradise. This also fits perfectly with what Enoch says about the third heaven in 2 Enoch being Paradise. But in 2 Enoch on the Northern side of the third heaven is what he describes as a very terrible place with cruel darkness and unillumined gloom.

Enoch says that Paradise is between corruptibility and incorruptibility. Paradise on the third heaven is prepared for the righteous and for them it's a place for eternal inheritance. The Northern side is prepared for those who dishonor God and it's their eternal inheritance.

2 Cor 12:2-4

I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the THIRD HEAVEN.

And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;)

How that he was caught up into PARADISE, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.

2 Enoch Chapter 8

1And those men took me thence, and led me up on to the THIRD HEAVEN, and placed me there; and I looked downwards, and saw the produce of these places, such as has never been known for goodness.

2And I saw all the sweet-flowering trees and beheld their fruits, which were sweet-smelling, and all the foods borne by them bubbling with fragrant exhalation.

3And in the midst of the TREES THAT OF LIFE, in that place whereon the Lord rests, when he goes up into PARADISE; and this tree is of ineffable goodness and fragrance, and adorned more than every existing thing; and on all sides it is in form gold-looking and vermilion and fire-like and covers all, and it has produce from all fruits.

4Its root is in the garden at the earth’s end.

5And PARADISE is between corruptibility and incorruptibility.

6And two springs come out which send forth honey and milk, and their springs send forth oil and wine, and they separate into four parts, and go round with quiet course, and go down into the PARADISE OF EDEN, between corruptibility and incorruptibility.

2 Enoch Chapter 10

1And those two men led me up on to the Northern side, and showed me there a very terrible place, and there were all manner of tortures in that place: cruel darkness and unillumined gloom, and there is no light there, but murky fire constantly flaming aloft, and there is a fiery river coming forth, and that whole place is everywhere fire, and everywhere there is frost and ice, thirst and shivering, while the bonds are very cruel, and the angels fearful and merciless, bearing angry weapons, merciless torture, and I said:

2Woe, woe, how very terrible is this place.

The Grigori or Watchers are said to look like a man, but much taller, larger and silent. Now we can begin to understand why the mixing of Watcher and women brought forth Giants [Nephilim] as their offspring. The good Watchers [Grigori] reside in the fifth heaven while the fallen Watchers [Grigori] are imprisoned in the second heaven [Abyss, Bottomless Pit, Underworld, Tartarus]. In 2 Enoch we can see in Chapter 7 that heaven two is the prison for the fallen Watchers and in Chapter 18 heaven five is the dwelling place of the good Watchers.

The Chief good Grigori [Watchers] are believed to be the Archangels....[Uriel, Rapheal, Michael, Zerachiel, Gabriel and Remiel].

Look closely at verse 1 of Chapter 7 and you will see how DARK the Angels appear to Enoch. Also verse 5 of Chapter 18 and you will see their prison "UNDER EARTH".

2 Enoch Chapter 7

1And those men took me and led me up on to the second heaven, and showed me darkness, greater than earthly darkness, and there I saw prisoners hanging, watched, awaiting the great and boundless judgment, and these angels were dark-looking, more than earthly darkness, and incessantly making weeping through all hours.

2And I said to the men who were with me: Wherefore are these incessantly tortured? They answered me: These are God’s apostates, who obeyed not God’s commands, but took counsel with their own will, and turned away with their prince, who also is fastened on the fifth heaven.

3And I felt great pity for them, and they saluted me, and said to me: Man of God, pray for us to the Lord; and I answered to them: Who am I, a mortal man, that I should pray for angels? Who knows whither I go, or what will befall me? Or who will pray for me?

2 Enoch Chapter 18

1The men took me on to the fifth heaven and placed me, and there I saw many and countless soldiers, called Grigori [Watchers], of human appearance, and their size was greater than that of great giants and their faces withered, and the silence of their mouths perpetual, and their was no service on the fifth heaven, and I said to the men who were with me:

2Wherefore are these very withered and their faces melancholy, and their mouths silent, and wherefore is there no service on this heaven?

3And they said to me: These are the Grigori [Watchers], who with their prince Satanail rejected the Lord of light, and after them are those who are held in great darkness on the second heaven, and three of them went down on to earth from the Lord’s throne, to the place Ermon, and broke through their vows on the shoulder of the hill Ermon and saw the daughters of men how good they are, and took to themselves wives, and befouled the earth with their deeds, who in all times of their age made lawlessness and mixing, and giants are born and marvellous big men and great enmity.

4And therefore God judged them with great judgment, and they weep for their brethren and they will be punished on the Lord’s great day.

5And I said to the Grigori [Watchers]: I saw your brethren and their works, and their great torments, and I prayed for them, but the Lord has condemned them to be under earth till the existing heaven and earth shall end for ever.

6And I said: Wherefore do you wait, brethren, and do not serve before the Lord’s face, and have not put your services before the Lord’s face, lest you anger your Lord utterly?

7And they listened to my admonition, and spoke to the four ranks in heaven, and lo! As I stood with those two men four trumpets trumpeted together with great voice, and the Grigori [Watchers] broke into song with one voice, and their voice went up before the Lord pitifully and affectingly.

The fallen Watchers are imprisoned on the second heaven. These are only the ones that came to earth, mixed with women and taught heavenly secrets.

The Watchers on the fifth heaven AREN'T imprisoned, they never were part of the Watchers that mixed with women and taught secrets. They are only very sad for their brethren the Watchers that are held in the prison [Abyss].

No Fallen Angel's or evil spirits, unclean spirits, demons, devils want to be imprisoned in the Abyss. They can't stand the thought of being sent to that horrible place. They will only be free from their prison when the Angel who is given the key, unlocks the Bottomless Pit [Abyss].

They then will be used by God as a judgment on those that have not the seal of God in their foreheads during the later day's. They won't be able to kill man but will torment him greatly for five months.

Some believe this Angel that is given the key will be none other than Satan himself, but I don't believe it could be. This same Angel that was given the key to unlock the Bottomless Pit [Abyss] will be the same Angel that soon after will cast Satan into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him.

Rev 20:1-3

And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 Runes110

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

As you can see in my above post from 2 Enoch, Satanail [Satan] is the Watchers prince and they rejected the Lord of Light [God]. I believe what Enoch is telling us in ( 2 Enoch Chapter 7 verse 2 ) is that when Satan was throw out of the upper heaven or heavens he fastened [To make fast or secure, To become attached, fixed, or joined] on the fifth heaven.

This sounds to me like he was cast out of the upper heavens [ten, nine, eight, seven, and six]. The tenth heaven is where Gods throne is located and I believe Satan could go all the way to the tenth heaven BEFORE his fall. He may very well have been as close to God as having a seat to the left of God. Remember in The Bible that Jesus Christ takes his seat to the right of The Father.

Once Enoch reached the seventh heaven he could see far off God sitting on his throne on the tenth heaven. Enoch was trembling with great terror and fear at what he was seeing. All the heavenly troops standing on the ten steps according to their rank that lead upward to the throne of God [Aravat, or Father of Creation].

2 Enoch Chapter 20

1And those two men lifted me up thence on to the seventh heaven, and I saw there a very great light, and fiery troops of great archangels, incorporeal forces, and dominions, orders and governments, cherubim and seraphim, thrones and many-eyed ones, nine regiments, the Ioanit stations of light, and I became afraid, and began to tremble with great terror, and those men took me, and led me after them, and said to me:

2Have courage, Enoch, do not fear, and showed me the Lord from afar, sitting on His very high throne. For what is there on the tenth heaven, since the Lord dwells there?

3On the tenth heaven is God, in the Hebrew tongue he is called Aravat.

4And all the heavenly troops would come and stand on the ten steps according to their rank, and would bow down to the Lord, and would again go to their places in joy and felicity, singing songs in the boundless light with small and tender voices, gloriously serving him.

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Tue Nov 01, 2022 6:29 am

Thank you, ScaRZ ! I'm amazed at all that information. Can't wait to really study it.

Yes, I do remember the 'third heaven' from Paul, and kind of assumed there must be more
I just missed. But no. And particularly being from Enoch, I wouldn't have seen it.
BUT! It's okay to be aware.
These same mentioned beings are very active now, I'm thinking. And we will see it soon enough.

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

One of the things that really got me thinking was 2 Enoch says that Paradise is between corruptibility and incorruptibility.

As I mentioned....."Take all of this with a grain of salt." I just study and try digging deep into the written words. I'm not pushing it as fact. This can become very uncomfortable for a lot of people.

Corruptibility is the flesh of mankind as well as this realm we find ourselves living in. We and it are corruptible to the core.

Incorruptibility is the goal we are all hoping and praying to obtain from The LORD God. We must put off the old and put on the new. This is eternity and a total rebirth that will place us in a different realm.

Now if Paradise is between corruptibility and incorruptibility, then it would be a realm somewhere in the very middle. It would not be the realm we find ourselves in now which is Corruptibility, but it also would not be the eternal realm of the Incorruptibility.

I automatically think back to Eden and the Two Trees in The very Middle of The Garden of Eden. One Tree.....The Tree of The Knowledge of Good and Evil, is corruptibility, and brings decay and death. One Tree.....The Tree of Life, is incorruptibility, and brings eternal life.

The middle ground is Paradise.

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

How this thinking is carried a little further we can read the words of Jesus as he speaks to one of the criminals on the cross.

Luke 23:43........And He said to him, "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise."

Jesus as well as this criminal would both die on a cross this day, and this day be in the realm of Paradise. Once again I can see where this thinking is taking us. They are both leaving the Corruptibility of this realm but are not entering the realm of Incorruptibility. They will both be in the realm of the between (The Middle Ground) which is Paradise.

Jesus will remain three days and three nights in Paradise until his resurrection takes place. When this event occurs Jesus will take on a rebirth of Incorruptibility. Jesus did not ascend to The Father until his completion of forty days on earth. The witnesses of his disciples was needed to confirm the fulfillment of prophecy and to strengthen, teach and prepare His disciples for the work before them.

The criminal remains between Corruptibility and Incorruptibility which is Paradise until his day of resurrection and rebirth that allows him to enter the eternal realm of Incorruptibility.

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Wed Nov 02, 2022 11:20 am

I would appreciate some prayer folks, it appears that the mystery is solved. I just got back from the doctor and about to leave again....It appears that I have lung cancer. I kinda' knew it. It is what it is...........m

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Wed Nov 02, 2022 4:56 pm

Michael, my favorite Alabama redneck and brother from a different mother... You are in my prayers always. Please keep us updated as you seem fit.

!! FOXTROT JULIET BRAVO !!

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Wed Nov 02, 2022 5:02 pm

Oh dear. Yes, prayers for you, Michael! The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 1f64f

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Wed Nov 02, 2022 9:17 pm

Mike, You and the Mrs. are in my prayers and will be every day and night . We love you both Mike. My eyes would still be closed if the Lord had not put ya'll in my path or maybe me in your path.. To just think, it all started with a middle buster ( garden tool ya'll ) around 12 years ago.. God bless and watch over you both Mike . Your friend in Christ, praying for a miracle, judy

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

michael371 wrote:: I would appreciate some prayer folks, it appears that the mystery is solved. I just got back from the doctor and about to leave again....It appears that I have lung cancer. I kinda' knew it. It is what it is...........m

I don’t know what to say Michael. I’m so sorry you have to face this. You will be in my prayers.

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Thu Nov 03, 2022 6:18 am

every single one of you will face death, just like I am. I will write about my feelings in a couple of days, as soon as the CT scan results are back, although its not a secret. I've been sick with something all summer and this weight loss was a tipoff.......m

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

God Hath Not Promised

God hath not promised
Skies always blue.
Flowers strewn pathways
All our lives through;
God hath not promised
Sun without rain,
Joy without sorrow,
Peace without pain.
But God hath promised
Strength for the day,
Rest for the labor,
Light for the way.
Grace for the trials
help from above,
Unfailing sympathy
Undying love.

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Thu Nov 03, 2022 7:51 am

The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 Efe4989786f0447d

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Thu Nov 03, 2022 3:29 pm

Well, brothers and sisters, I just returned from a sit down concerning the CT scan and just as I expected, not good, actually worse. My wife had hope due to the previous bouts with cancer, but my Hezekiah years are exhausted. Its in the lungs,liver,adrenal gland, likely the kidneys and probably the bones. I have no chance of survival other than maybe a few months life extension, and pain management. I knew the day was coming as does and cancer survivor. Somewhere/sometime its coming back. I have to do a few things but I'll write better things from now on.

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Thu Nov 03, 2022 3:52 pm

That's very overwhelming Michael. I'd still fight back like gang busters. It can't hurt and could very
well help alot. There are people fighting and winning all the time with natural things.

Here is this from Mike Adams
https://watchermeet-up.forumotion.com/t22056-spice-beats-chemo-study-reveals-turmeric-is-more-effective-at-killing-cancer-cells-than-chemo-or-radiation?highlight=cancer+cures

I'll find the man's testimony on Fen____ whatever it is. He had a sentence like yours. He says it killed all the cancer. And he's still around to talk about it, so...
Once it's in your system, any product will work throughout your body, meaning
you don't have to address each body part..

At the least, it could help with quality of life. These are inexpensive, readily available things to give a try.
Give me the green light and I'll start gathering some of the top options.

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Fri Nov 04, 2022 7:19 am

The Lord is my shepherd; I shall not want.
²He maketh me to lie down in green pastures: he leadeth me beside the still waters.
³He restoreth my soul: he leadeth me in the paths of righteousness for his name's sake.
⁴Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil: for thou art with me; thy rod and thy staff they comfort me.
⁵Thou preparest a table before me in the presence of mine enemies: thou anointest my head with oil; my cup runneth over.
⁶Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life: and I will dwell in the house of the Lord for ever.

Verse 4 is most likely a verse that I have misunderstood all of my life and I suppose that it started when I was a kid. As kids, believe it or not, we had to learn this chapter. We memorized it and said it every morning in Mrs. Willena Davis's 2nd grade class. I always thought that it meant when you died and "the valley of the shadow of death" was when you died and went to Jesus. Maybe its not.

Its really aggravating when you find out that you have misinterpreted various scripture due to outside influence, like authors,preachers,teachers etc, and carried it over into your own study and theology. I've done that so much that it takes almost as much time to ferret untrue ideas out as it does to delve into the truth.

I wish that I see all of you and visit for a while. My participation has dwindled lately, but I guess we know why now. I knew that I didn't have the normal "pizzazz" but I put it off on age. Jesus has got this,though......m

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

David Flynn wrote:

"By genetically manipulating human genetics, whether through the guise of "alien abduction" or by supplying willing mortal accomplices with the proper technology... there is currently being created humanoid hybrids who are not-quite-human. These genetically altered humans are no longer Sons of Adam, and no longer able to be saved by the Kinsman Redeemer. The second wave of hybrid "Nephilim creation" is Satan's last effort to destroy all Sons of Adam, so that none can be redeemed when Jesus Christ returns at the End of the Age."

This below reminds me of words Michael has written.

A friend.....Doug wrote:

I believe the hybrids are here and have been for some time.
However, the picture is not simple and it is everchanging.

As I have told you before, I think that they will aid in making an army for the Antichrist and will be used to interject in important positions of control and propaganda.

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

Peter Goodgame wrote:

The number 72 is hugely important in Egyptian religion, in the Kabbalah and also in the occult Hermeticism that came into the West after the fall of ancient Egypt. The 72 are the Kosmokrators, or World Powers identified by Paul in Ephesians 6:12. They represent the symbolic number of Gentile nations of the world according to Biblical tradition. When Jesus chose 72 disciples in Luke 10 to demonstrate the power of God's Kingdom over the power of Satan He showed that He understood this spiritual reality. The 72 that Jesus chose foreshadowed the fall of Satan "like lightning from heaven," which is a mission continued on this earth today by every Spirit-filled Believer. Our role is to be salt and light to the world and to push back the kingdom of darkness everywhere we go!

The Adversary and his dark forces will come at all of us, but at our weakest points they will come at us with temptations that are hardest for us to reject. It can be physical weakness (Body), mental weakness (Soul), and spiritual weakness (Spirit).

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Sat Nov 05, 2022 10:33 am

The 72 are the Kosmokrators, or World Powers
------------------------
Know them as spirits.

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Sat Nov 05, 2022 10:38 am

Hey, hey, I see Scarz started a post on a subject that makes my ears and eyes perk up. After a great phone conversation with Bordercollie yesterday, I see this post and really get happy.

I don't think that it take a geneticist to look at some of these people causing havoc in our time to realize that something is out of whack in their intellectual metabolism. Their thinking all skewed and they seem incapable of making rational decisions or forming coherent thoughts and expressions,nor can they seem to to be able to perform small tasks such as changing a tire or building a dog pen,etc. What they can do is take the modern technological advances and work magic, as well as to continue to develop it.

Homosexual behavior,as well as other sexually deviant behavior is rampant in these people's circles, as well as riotous behavior. I guess that you noticed that these degenerates like to kill babies? That is their sacrifice to Nimrod/Tammuz/Molech/Baal in order to continue their lawless and Godless ways. See, modern folks don't put any credence into this line of thinking due to the level of "sophistication" that society operates at today. Modern man is way too educated to be considering demons,fallen angels, pagan religion practices, especially when they don't directly affect them..........until they walk into 1st Baptist, or 2nd Penecostal or 3rd Methodist and so on and on. Then they are confronted by it and don't even know it. That is a broad statement for illustration but you get the picture.

Roman Catholicism has been the carrier organism for the infected DNA to operate. Mystery Babylon is hidden right in plain sight within the walls of the Vatican, and the "protestant" churches as well as most Baptist churches, have allowed the bastardized form of so-called Christianity to creep into their walls as well.

Most Christians are so biblically ignorant that its amazing to me that they can separate the OT from the NT. Hell, Bordercollie and I were talking about how many churches did the Halloween thing with kids totally oblivious to the idea that they might be participating in a programming session that would carry throughout that childs life that would perpetuate the lie that stuff like that is just fine.

Got company coming,so later on

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

Dove wrote:: The 72 are the Kosmokrators, or World Powers
------------------------
Know them as spirits.

Peter.....is pointing to the 72 as The Fallen Sons of God who were allotted the Gentile nations to rule over at the fall of Babel. He leads us to Ephesians 6:12: "against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world". The "Rulers" are these Fallen Sons of God.

Strong's #2888: kosmokrator (pronounced kos-mok-fat'-ore)

from 2889 and 2902; a world-ruler, an epithet of Satan:--ruler.

Peter takes the number 72 or that of 70 as only symbolic....."Some say 70 and others read 72."

My thoughts I take a little deeper below.

There are humans in bed with the Main Masters......."In other words, humans are a part of the controlling forces much like the German soldiers in charge of the concentration camps." The Main Masters are the ultimate controllers and "ALL" others including the controlling forces are controlled by them.

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

A friend I will call "7" wrote this:

I think the bible holds Truth. (capital T)

I don't think God made any "mistakes" when he transferred his words into human hands through prophets or caretakers of the Word before it became the Bible. I think the Word as it will be remembered in our future will have a number of contexts applied to it that will not be present in our time.

I also have faith that God knew ahead of time that His words and those of His messengers would eventually be repeated, re-edited, translated or maintained without changes to the original. I am supposing he made provisions for that so that the body of the "written word" would never be completely destroyed or diluted by the faiths that came later.

I assume (and have faith) that the written word will complete it's intended purpose and eventual mark in history that it was intended for.

-----------------------------

Having said all that, I do think God knows more about everything than even we think we do as a world.

God paints a long historical story of beings whom act independently and corrupt His original works. Lets call "them" higher order beings (Angels/Celestial Entities). The tale goes on to say that God and his entire kingdom (everything that we don't know about) is for the time being mysterious to us as mortal beings facing the conditions that we are facing today.

I believe that these Higher Order Beings from elsewhere or somewhere else did come to Earth and manifested corporeal forms. They mated with corporeal life and brought into existence life forms (hybrids) possessing both human and non-human qualities.

I believe these Higher Order Beings, have technology both of the physical types that we are familiar with and non-corporeal technology that we aren't very familiar with.

I also believe they interfere in God and His Plan to effectively change the course of events and...in effect...corrupt it in some way at different levels.

Higher Order life forms teaching or performing changes on Genetics, Our Mentality, Sharing Technological Knowledge, etc.

-----------------------

Something which runs contrary (as far as I can tell) to the somewhat stated nature that God had outlined for our kind.

-----------------------

I believe, that when the truth comes out, the living elements of this hidden history and those whom perpetuate negative changes will come floating to the surface and will destroy a major portion of humanity for their purpose. (The ones that oppose or live contrary to the plan of God)

I also believe that the majority, having been so corrupted on so many levels, will not accept the plan that God has laid out for our kind when it is proposed openly.

I figure it should stand so against the modern world and way, that to stomach it will be impossible unless some core changes occur prior to the revelation(s).

In effect, you are either ready, or you aren't by then. I believe that God's Plan will be good and sound, but unpalatable by everyone whom has soaked too long in the grease and grime that the world has become.

----------------------------------

I think that the Bible does not ignore the phenomena that a number of people in the population are a witness to. Both strictly paranormal and nuts and bolts.

I think the hierarchy that governs this opposing plan will one day come to light. I believe there will be more than one that comes in "it's name". "It's name" is probably the name of the Being whom is the highest in the hierarchy of resistance to God Ways and his Works.

"It" embodies everything that is found without and absent of God. ("It")

The ones whom come in "it's name" will only plow the world flat to the ground until the world is ready to receive (it's mark), know it and ultimately agree with it.

----------------------------

If God embodies Love, then "It" will embody what a Higher Order Entity lacks when it no longer has God by it's side.

I wouldn't be surprised if the second level of the Its' Hierarchy appeals to everyone in some way. And that is where the danger only begins.

----------------------------

I have already heard some of lies and rumors that will allegedly be said (hearsay, claims, thorough warnings).

I don't even bother repeating a lot of them. Because they sound so convincing and appeal in so many ways that I fear that even fellow Christians would be shaken if they heard some of the re-told arguments and sayings that I have been told Others will use in the future.

They weren't even told to me as to convince me of anything. But just listening to the contents of warnings about what will likely be said put a big notch of doubt inside me in it's own way. If you let it eat away at you, it'll burn a hole right through faith unless your already decided.

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

I want to thank "7" for laying things out in detail. The whole post was packed full of great material. The one sentence that my eyes fixated on was what I will quote below.

"I wouldn't be surprised if the second level of the (It's) Hierarchy appeals to everyone in some way. And that is where the danger only begins."

If there isn't an overall appeal by the vast majority then in my opinion it doesn't have a leg to stand on. "The World" must accept in their hearts, minds, and very souls or the plan crumbles.

I see first the "system" as being in a weakened state. It will be up and running but with much infighting. The something that is missing will be the key.

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

People assume that they will know evil when they see it. Or that they will recognize (It's) descendants if they saw it.

People can become desensitized and evil that was once visible has become blind to them. A "Powerful Force" can feed a persons desires and can and will blot out morals, goodness, and love. Evil can move into society quickly and become a willing bed partner.

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Mon Nov 07, 2022 8:20 am

I enjoyed that Scarz. Evil can sure move in softly and unnoticed. We can look anywhere and see it moving in. The pace is picking up as we see it brushing off on society from tv shows internet , and other people. What my Mama and Daddy told me well over a half century ago, " If you lay with dogs , you get fleas" is true.
We must keep our eyes open and senses aware. The "fleas" are everywhere and are hungry. They're desperate for a bite and won't stop .. always trying to get to ya. Focus on our Savior and when in despair , ask Him , He will help .

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Mon Nov 07, 2022 12:04 pm

I'm turning this over to the experts here.

There are archtypes which seem to reoccur and play out throughout history.

One, said to have already been won was Enki and Enlil.
https://search.brave.com/search?q=Enki+and+Elel&source=desktop

Then there's Egypt and the Eye of Ra, and all the symbolism we encounter in the
Illuminate Cabal.
I'm assuming Osiris is the incarnation of Ra. Isis, the Queen, and Horus the son.
Think antichrist here. And will the Cabal follow the script? They have been
exercising the magik and 'religion' of ancient Egypt so far.
They just had their COP27 ceremony, which needs looking into.
--
Everything I've seen/read in the past months substantiates that Egypt preceded
Babylon and survived the flood. Much of the Valley of the Kings is still buried
in 40-45 feet of sand. But they're digging like crazy. They just don't want
the world to know what they're finding.

So...can you do anything with this? The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 1f609

Does it open any new doors of perspective?
Particularly when the gods were on the earth. And why they are coming back-
or trying to. Wishful thinking or not, they always intended to resurrect.
-----

One more. Does this support your Babylon research?
And what is Babylon's connection to Egypt? (simple, right? The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 1f604

)

The cult of Baal.
The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 Fg-sYdjVsAAbIx8?format=jpg&name=small

One of the Skywatch tv gentlemen had a book on Shinar.
I looked quick and didn't find it.
But this one could be relevant :
https://bookshop.org/books/the-shinar-directive-preparing-the-way-for-the-son-of-perdition-s-return/9780990497431

(no good-can't be accessed/found)

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Mon Nov 07, 2022 1:54 pm

OH...DUR. Cabal = kabbalah
---
SEPHIROT MAP of BAAL Worship; Cannibalism
The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 Fg-qHZ5VsAAdOQ7?format=jpg&name=small

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Mon Nov 07, 2022 2:32 pm

CULT of BAAL
The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 Fg-qzsQUcAA6nqa?format=jpg&name=small

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Mon Nov 07, 2022 4:54 pm

EDIT: Ooops! I meant to post this in the daily. Just pretend that I did. Wink

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

For the record - I early voted today. I was the only one there when I arrived - only one other person was there when I departed. Poll worker said only about a dozen or so had voted so far since opening this morning. Time was ~11am PST.

Got a cool "I Voted" sticker in 5 different languages upon departing. (if you count English)

The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 I_vote10

!! FOXTROT JULIET BRAVO !!

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

Dove wrote:: There are archtypes which seem to reoccur and play out throughout history.

One more. Does this support your Babylon research?
And what is Babylon's connection to Egypt?

You are correct Dove, many archtypes that play out. This is a very deep subject that relies on the myths and legends. How do the myths and legends tie together? You've got to dig into the ancient cultures of this earth. Names and titles will change as many different languages are introduced.

As a Christian we must dig into ancient text that many do not feel comfortable with. You can't just close your eyes, or there is no need anyone starting. I would say the vast majority of people who start will become bored very quickly. The rest just think it's a bunch of BS myths and don't care to waste their time.

I do believe it connects Babylon and Egypt. I see a connection with Nimrod and Osiris.

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Tue Nov 08, 2022 10:58 am

I do believe that the New Covenant of Abraham, of faith and belief, sealed by the All Sufficient Sacrifice, is altogether sufficient.

Still, there are those of us who are 'inclined' (Spiritually motivated) to understand the
deeper things.

Many I would think would trip over this historical definition of YHVH, which appears as having come from the Talmud , and still adopted by certain orthodox Jews.

Is the Name itself a problem, does it represent a deity other than the I AM THAT I AM, or does the problem only arise within the Talmud teachings/interpretations?
Is that an exceedingly deep dive? Again, it is beyond my studies thus far.

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

This below fits well into the topic being discussed.....Written by Peter Goodgame
********************************

The Sumerian scribes documented the names of kings and the cities that they ruled over, beginning with the founding of the great city of Eridu(g). The dating of these dynasties in terms of thousands of years is obviously exaggerated, (or else, as some scholars have argued, is a misunderstanding or mistranslation of the Sumerian cuneiform script). The fact remains, however, that the Sumerians placed the Great Flood solidly within their historical chronology.

British historian and biblical scholar David Rohl, coming from a secular perspective, offers evidence that the original city of Eridu was the very city founded by Cain in Genesis 4:17. When the Sumerian King List was later translated into Greek by the Babylonian High Priest Berossos around 280 BCE the name of this first city of Eridu was translated as "Babylon." In his commentary on Revelation 18 the early Church Father, Caesarius of Arles, offered support for the idea that Cain founded the original Babylon when he wrote,

Quote :: ...this is the city of all the proud and arrogant, which Cain established by the blood of his brother and which he named after his son, Enoch... For all the wicked in whom Babylon resides succeed one another and persecute the Church of God until the end of the world. In the city of Cain "all the righteous blood" is poured out "from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah"... This is the city which killed the prophets and stoned those who were sent to it. This is that city that is built upon blood, as the Scriptures say [Hab. 2], "Woe to him who builds a city with blood and founds a city on iniquity."

So we see that human civilization traces all the way back to the founding of the original Babylon by Cain, who was also the perpetrator of history's first murder. From this perspective the judgment upon Babylon in Revelation 18:24 begins to make much more sense: "And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth."

The Sumerian narrative gets even more interesting when we turn to events that took place after the flood. The first two dynasties that are mentioned after the flood on the Sumerian King List are the dynasties of Kish and the dynasties of Uruk. Kish is mentioned first, but it is possible that the first two kings of the dynasty of Uruk may have reigned before Kish right after the flood, who were then followed by the kings of Kish, who were then eclipsed several hundred years later by Uruk under the rule of Gilgamesh. This can be argued because of the fact that the Epic of Gilgamesh depicts Gilgamesh as a contemporary of King Aga, who was the last of the Kings of Kish. In other words, it was Gilgamesh of Uruk who brought an end to the Kish Dynasty, and therefore the kings of Uruk who preceded Gilgamesh must have ruled either before or alongside the kings of the Kish Dynasty.
The first two kings of the Dynasty of Uruk to rule in Sumer after the flood are described like this in the Sumerian King List:

Quote :

Meskiagkashar, son of Utu, became high priest and king - reigned 324 years. Meskiagkashar went down into the sea and came out at the mountains.
Enmerkar, the son of Meskiagkashar, the king of Uruk, who built Uruk - reigned 420 years.

It is interesting that the first king of the Uruk Dynasty reigned before the city of Uruk was even built. The actual founding of the city of Uruk is credited to Enmerkar, the second king of the "Dynasty of Uruk." The first king is the biblical Cush, who emigrated by sea from Mesopotamia and formed a colony that became named after him in the mountainous land of Cush (today's Ethiopia). The second king, who built the city of Uruk, is Nimrod the descendent of Cush who is credited in Genesis 10:10 with establishing a kingdom based in Shinar that was later expanded into northern Mesopotamia. Nimrod's southern base included the cities of Babel, Erech, Accad and Calneh. The city of Erech is of course Uruk, while the city of Babel is the very same city of Eridu that was first established by Cain before the Flood. In my book I bring forth the evidence that it was here in Eridu where the Tower of Babel was built. Eridu was the spiritual capital of Nimrod's kingdom, whereas Uruk (Erech) was his political capital from where his empire spread out.

These facts are all necessary simply to bring us to this point: The civilization of ancient Sumer experienced the very events that are described in the early chapters of Genesis. Their history goes right back to the very first city, documenting the Great Flood and the career of Nimrod and the Tower of Babel, as well as a continuous line of kings and dynasties afterwards. These histories eventually lead right into the reign of Hammurabi of Babylon who lived between the time of Abraham and Moses.

Now here is the problem: If we look to the MT date of 2348 BCE as the date for the Flood we simply don't have enough room to cram all of this Sumerian history in between that time and Hammurabi! There are just too many kings, too many dynasties and too much documented history to make it happen! We need an extra thousand years or so to make Biblical history line up with Sumerian history! And that is where the Septuagint comes in with its Flood date of 3536 BCE.

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Wed Nov 09, 2022 9:52 am

Wow! That was something impressive!
Your post, ScaRZ, evidences the WHY my studies always end up not very deep! The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 1f604

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

Quote :: "In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was one like a son of man, coming with the clouds of heaven. He approached the Ancient of Days and was led into his presence. He was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all peoples, nations and men of every language worshiped him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and his kingdom is one that will never be destroyed." (Daniel 7:13-14)

In the New Testament Jesus of Nazareth claimed that He was this very "Son of Man" mentioned enigmatically by the prophet Daniel, who would "inherit" all the nations of the world. Before His crucifixion Jesus was put on trial by the chief priests of the Sanhedrin. Caiaphas the High Priest demanded of Jesus, "Tell us if you are the Christ, the Son of God." In response Jesus said,

Quote :: "Yes, it is as you say... But I say to all of you: In the future you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven." (Matthew 26:64)

Because of this statement the High Priest accused Jesus of blasphemy, Jesus was sentenced to death, and the trial was immediately ended. There was absolutely no question that Jesus was claiming to be the Jewish Messiah who was predicted to one day rule as King over the nations of the world. Afterwards Jesus was brought before Pontius Pilate, the Roman ruler in charge of Palestine. Pilate repeated the question that had prompted the death sentence given by the High Priest: "Are you the king of the Jews?" Jesus replied by saying,

Quote :: "You are right in saying I am a king. In fact for this reason I was born, and for this I came into the world, to testify to the truth." (John 18:37)

However, Jesus prefaced this remark by saying, "My kingdom is not of this world." What Jesus meant was that His kingdom would first be a spiritual kingdom before becoming a physical earthly kingdom, which will only begin after the defeat, judgment, and destruction of the unholy "world powers." Foreshadows of this "spiritual kingdom" can be seen in an episode near the beginning of the ministry of Jesus, which reveals that Jesus knew He was dealing with a "world order" ruled by spiritual beings under the authority of Satan.

The Gospel of Luke explains that Jesus appointed seventy disciples to travel ahead of Jesus throughout Israel "to every city and every place." When they entered a house they were instructed to say "Peace be to this house," and then to give the message that "The kingdom of God is near you." Jesus even told these seventy messengers that if they entered a city and were not accepted into any homes then they were to proclaim their message in the streets.

Some of the Greek manuscripts that record this event say that Jesus appointed "seventy-two" disciples for this mission, but whether the actual number was seventy or seventy-two the symbolic intent behind the mission was clear: Jesus was serving notice to the spiritual powers behind the scenes that the Pagan World Order was coming to a close. The era of the "gods" was ending and the "Kingdom of God" would take its place. When the seventy disciples returned to Jesus they joyfully announced to him, "Lord, even the demons submit to us in your name." Jesus responded to them by saying (Luke 10:18),

Quote :: "I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven."

The spiritual "Kingdom of God" had just been established on earth, at the expense of Satan and the fallen angels. Jesus then went on to explain what this meant to His disciples (Luke 10:19-20, 23-24),

Quote :: "Behold, I have given you authority to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy, and nothing will injure you. Nevertheless do not rejoice in this, that the spirits are subject to you, but rejoice that your names are recorded in heaven...
Blessed are the eyes which see the things you see, for I say to you, that many prophets and kings wished to see the things which you see, and did not see them, and to hear the things which you hear, and did not hear them."

The fallen angels exist as two distinct groups. One group is already chained up in the Abyss and awaits the final judgment. Jude 6-7 connects the fallen angels of this group with the angels that had sexual relations with human women in Genesis 6 which states, "...the angels who did not keep their positions of authority but abandoned their own home--these he has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for judgment on the great Day." The Apostle Peter also refers to this group of angels bound in the Abyss: "...God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them into gloomy dungeons to be held for judgment" (2 Peter 2:4). Throughout the Gospels, when people were cured of demon possession, the demons would often be cast into the Abyss to await their judgment and punishment.

The other group of fallen angels is the group that the Apostle Paul refers to as the "powers of this dark world," and as the "spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms" (Ephesians 6:12). They exist in the heavens from where they attempt to manipulate the affairs of humanity as much as they are able, against the Church which has been given "all power" through the name and authority of Jesus Christ. For the last two thousand years this has been the spiritual struggle that Paul referred to in his letter to the Ephesians.

The book of Revelation explains that one day Satan and his fallen angels will be forcefully evicted from heaven and thrown down to earth, where they will be in control for only a short time before their judgment comes,

Quote :: "And there was war in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought back. But he was not strong enough, and they lost their place in heaven. The great dragon was hurled down--that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him." (Revelation 12:7-9)

The judgment upon the "spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms" is predicted by Isaiah the prophet as one of the results of the apocalyptic "Day of the Lord":

Quote :: "The earth is broken up, the earth is split asunder, the earth is thoroughly shaken. The earth reels like a drunkard, it sways like a hut in the wind; so heavy upon it is the guilt of its rebellion that it falls--never to rise again. In that day the LORD will punish the powers in the heavens above and the kings on the earth below. They will be herded together like prisoners bound in a dungeon; they will be shut up in prison and be punished after many days. The moon will be abashed, the sun ashamed; for the LORD Almighty will reign on Mount Zion and in Jerusalem, and before its elders, gloriously." (Isaiah 24:19-23)

The prophet Jeremiah simply states:

Quote :: "These gods, who did not make the heavens and the earth, will perish from the earth and from under the heavens." (Jeremiah 10:11)

The book of Revelation is a detailed account of the final confrontation between God and the "gods" before the Messianic Kingdom is established. Central to this conflict is a document held by God that is described as a Scroll sealed with seven Seals, which many scholars of Bible prophecy believe to be something like a Title Deed to the earth. In the aftermath of the Tower of Babel and the death of Nimrod this Deed became the property of the seventy angelic princes and Satan their leader. That is why Satan was able to tempt Jesus by offering to give Him authority over the kingdoms of the world in Matthew 4. Satan could offer it because it was Satan's possession to give. That is also why the Kingdom of God is only a spiritual kingdom for now, and "not of this world."

But one day this world will be taken away from the "gods" and given into the hands of the Son of God. The precise moment that this occurs is shown in Revelation, after the blowing of the seventh Trumpet, which is the final Trumpet released by the breaking of the seventh Seal of the Scroll:

Quote :: "The seventh angel sounded his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven, which said: 'The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ, and he will reign for ever and ever.' And the twenty-four elders, who were seated on their thrones before God, fell on their faces and worshiped God, saying: 'We give thanks to you, Lord God Almighty, the One who is and who was, because you have taken your great power and have begun to reign. The nations were angry; and your wrath has come. The time has come for judging the dead, and for rewarding your servants the prophets and your saints and those who reverence your name, both small and great-- and for destroying those who destroy the earth.' " (Revelation 11:15-18)

Until that moment the earth will still be the physical property of Satan and the fallen angels. Within this system human beings are also the possession of Satan, as harsh as that may sound. Redemption from this terrible situation can only be achieved through faith in the sacrifice of Jesus Christ. The book of Revelation explains that it was this divine sacrifice, of the life of the Son of God given on behalf of human beings everywhere, that "purchased men for God":

Quote :: "Then I saw a Lamb, looking as if it had been slain, standing in the center of the throne, encircled by the four living creatures and the elders... He came and took the scroll from the right hand of him who sat on the throne. And when he had taken it, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb... And they sang a new song: 'You are worthy to take the scroll and to open its seals, because you were slain, and with your blood you purchased men for God from every tribe and language and people and nation. You have made them to be a kingdom and priests to serve our God, and they will reign on the earth.' " (Revelation 5:6-10)

The Second Coming of Jesus Christ will put an end to the strange situation that presently exists in our little corner of the universe, of fallen angelic spirits ruling over a fallen earth that is inhabited by fallen human beings. The fallen angels will be cast into the Abyss, judged, and finally destroyed, along with the human beings that they were able to deceive. On the other hand, those who reject the lies and deception of the "world powers," who embrace the Creator and Jesus Christ as their Savior, will be raised up from their fallen condition and given an eternal life with infinite rewards.

But that is looking into the future. Today the world still exists in its fallen condition, manipulated by spiritual beings that look forward to a brief period when they will enjoy power and authority as they exercised it in the past. The central figure in this brief demonic renaissance is known as the Beast in the book of Revelation, and named the Antichrist by John the Apostle (1 John 2:18).

Written by Peter Goodgame:

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

"Host (Hebrew = saba/tsaba) of heaven" ("army of the skies")

Host of heaven has two basic meanings depending on the context...

1 Heavenly Bodies = stars - as created things and/or as objects of idolatry

2 Heavenly Beings = angels or spirit beings

The first Scriptural use of "Host of Heaven" is found in Deut 4:19

Deut 4:19 "And beware not to lift up your eyes to heaven and see the sun and the moon and the stars, all the host of heaven, and be drawn away and worship them and serve them (note the progressive decline in the preceding verbs), those which the LORD your God has allotted to all the peoples under the whole heaven."

The pagan nations of Canaan, as well as Egypt and the other nations of antiquity, had once known the true God of creation but had long since become evolutionary pantheists, worshipping the creation instead of the Creator (see notes Romans 1:20-21, 1:22-23, 1:24-25). The children of Israel were repeatedly warned against this influence but repeatedly succumbed to it in later years--just as have people in every age. The first of the ten commandments, "Thou shalt have no other gods before me" (Exodus 20:3) was given explicitly to guard against this ever-present Satanic temptation.

Jeremiah records that despite God's clear warning not to worship the host of heaven they disobeyed...

"And the houses of Jerusalem and the houses of the kings of Judah will be defiled like the place Topheth, because of all the houses on whose rooftops (flat roofs of the houses were used for worshiping astral deities) they burned sacrifices to all the heavenly host and poured out libations to other gods." (Jer 19:13)

In summary the first Scriptural use of the phrase host of heaven is a warning to Israel not to exchange worship of the Creator for the worship of the creation that included the host of heaven.

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

For as long as I can remember I've never been without dreams. From the time I begin to sleep I dream new dreams or continued dreams. Many times they just pickup and continue where they left off. Most dreams and nightmares are what I call regular, but some are what I call deep dreams. The deep dreams are the ones I believe have great value.

When I have deep dreams I can remember them very easily and they seem to carry a vision and purpose. As I awaken from a deep dream I feel differently. It's hard to explain to someone the feeling it brings and the after thoughts that are left behind.

One night many years ago I had a deep dream and I knew I was dreaming, so I was telling myself to do what I normally wouldn't do in every day life.

As I was about to reach out and take some money from an open register in a mall store, a clear voice spoke to me as our conscience does and told me not to do it.

I said to the voice within, it's only a dream and it doesn't really matter if I steal the money because....IT'S only a dream. The voice then told me, you are not correct, even in dreams there is right and wrong.

I have had what I call deep dreams for a very long time in my life. Most of the time the dreams and nightmares are only that......."Just plain ordinary dreams and nightmares." An example would be if I have 100 dreams and nightmares, not even close to 1% would ever be what I call a deep dream.

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Mon Nov 14, 2022 1:43 pm

You know, just because nobody can engage in conversation at times doesn't mean we aren't
reading and learning from what you post. Wink

I'd love to get into the the dreams post. My first thought was of Jesus saying we are responsible for
every THOUGHT..not just what we say or do.

In a way that's a huge burden of responsibility. But in another it's a real door into the true nature
of reality and life.
Not only how could this be so, but more importantly, why is this so. Wink

And it would invariably take us to discussions so many do not want to have. Wink

But if you want to, I'll be reading and try to respond too.

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Mon Nov 14, 2022 8:27 pm

I have "dreams" that answer worries I have and how to solve them, but then, also ones that make no sense. Usually though, they have meaning in some form. Years ago, I had a dream that I told ya'll about on a post back then. It concerned a loved one that had passed taking my hand as I slept and letting it slide thru their fingers as if to mean I would be ok from now on and that was it. - depend on the Lord only. This was more complicated than just a dream because I had , had strange experiences in working hours with my passed away family member. Not visually, but other occurrences such as things we had talked about (buying peaches in Forest City Ar. (then a week after the passing , an advertisement for buying them fading into my local Christian radio station (KLove) from that frar off city in AR. I was in C MS . More like that for a short time Nothing else after the hand dream though. .
I also had a calf in dire straits several years ago.. We got the calf and mama to the barn . It could only lay there. Head down and unable to eat. It was a very cold winter day so I looked over at the calf and asked the Lord "should I try or give up "? then this warm wind blew over me and I looked back at the calf, his eyes rolled back and he raised his head a bit .. I knew I was to try because the Lord was behind me . I prayed about it, went to sleep and knew what to do to try and save it when I woke up. Don't get me wrong , it wasn't easy but I knew to try. I built a sling with a little hoist and never gave up. He learned to walk and grew up. The Lord is always there ready to listen.

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Mon Nov 14, 2022 8:44 pm

Sweet stories. The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 1f60a

My thought was, 'to Listen AND to Answer.'
We Love because He first Loved us. And shared with us Himself and His Ways.

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

This deep dream I wrote down and saved it on my computer years ago. I have several deep dreams that I have written down over the years.

I was walking along a rural road and I met a man coming from the opposite direction. I never even had an opportunity to speak to him before he said......."Elijah is waiting for you."

I ask the man where I could find Elijah and he pointed on down the road I was on. I never said anything more to the man and began walking straight ahead. I walked a good distance down the road which had a few twist and one deep curve before I noticed a man standing off the road near a huge rock.

I walked straight up to him and ask him if he was Elijah. He then spoke to me and said that he was Elijah and he had been waiting for me. In the dream I then knew this was Elijah the prophet. There was no doubting who he was and the dream made that perfectly clear to me.

I then ask Elijah why he was waiting for me. Elijah then pulled out some beautiful stones from his pocket and held them in both of his hands for me to see.

He never ask me to touch them or take them from his extended hands. Elijah only wanted me to look at them. They were the most beautiful jewels I had ever seen with my eyes. They glowed so brightly they looked like rainbow colored stones of fire.

The dream then ended as I lay on my back staring at the ceiling.
As soon as I had awaken from the dream I remembered the stones in the Book of Revelation.

Revelation 21:19-20

And the foundations of the wall of the city were garnished with all manner of precious stones. The first foundation was jasper; the second, sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald;

The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolite; the eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst.

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Wed Nov 16, 2022 6:18 pm

This 6 min vid on the Khazars. maybe good-maybe not

explains who they were.
how, when they chose Judaism as their religion, they followed the Talmud, not the Torah.

The Jewish encyclopedia identifies them as people of TURKISH ORIGIN.

they are of Persian origin, not Semetic. So the area of Turkey was once part
of Persia?

(interesting that THEY scream constantly over anti-Semitism. another trick)

https://rumble.com/v1rp7xe-revealed-hidden-history-of-the-khazar-kingdom.html

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

In a Native American parable, the Creator gathers all the animals and says: I want to hide something from humans until they are ready for it - the realization that they create their own reality.

Give it to me. I'll fly it to the moon,
says the eagle. No, one day soon they will go there and find it.

How about the bottom of the ocean?
asks the salmon. No, they will find it there too.

I will bury it in the great plains,
says the buffalo. They will soon dig and find it there.

Put it inside them,
says the wise grandmother mole. Done,
says the Creator. It is the last place they will look.

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

Your "Ability/Abilities" may be something far different than my ability/abilities but I believe all of us have abilities/gifts/talents.

Example:

I may have an "Ability" to move people with my voice. I can use my speaking ability to draw people and touch something deep within them.

This gift, this talent, this ability can be used for The Lord and bring about a great array of goodness. Outside of The Lord it can be used for utter destruction of people and nations.

Just because I have an ability doesn't mean for one second there are not boundaries I should not cross. There are boundaries for everyone with every "Ability". This is where we will drift into when The voice of The Lord is gradually in small doses replaced with the voice of The World.

The Lord wants to always come first in your life, he wants to lead you......."Will you let him lead, will you listen to him, will you follow him, will you trust what he ask of you." The flesh, self and desires of The World want to lead also. It will be an ongoing battle fought until the great change occurs......."Off with the old, on with the new."

"Listen to the inner voice of The Lord."

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

There are many abilities that people use, but if we look closely which side do they line up on. People lust for the great light show and fall prey to wolves. What at first drew you in with the look and smell of a rose can blind you from seeing the thorns that await to prick you.

Dark forces will use our fleshly desires in an attempt to get us out of the will of God.

Do you remember how the devil used the temptations that were brought against Jesus Christ?

The devil new the abilities of Jesus and he attempted to draw Jesus into using them to separate him from the will of The Father. Jesus was hungry and what did the devil say to him?........"If thou be the Son of God, command this stone that it be made bread." (Luke 4:3)

The devil not only was attempting to get Jesus to use his abilities to fulfill the desires of the flesh and get him out of the will of The Father, but he also was trying to get Jesus to doubt he was The Son of God........"If he did not use his abilities."

Jesus answered the temptation of the desires of the flesh by saying........"It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God." (Luke 4:4)

You can read the four gospels and very quickly see Jesus Christ never used his abilities to heal everyone he came in contact with. Think of all the sick, lame, blind, deaf, demon possessed, and dead he was near but never used his abilities on.

The more miracles that are seen, or used upon people, it can take away from just pure "Faith".

People can take their abilities and use them to draw attention to "Themselves". They can become proud, boastful, and very quickly the gift becomes a drug that feeds only their desires.

What once was an ability to be used for God, for his purpose, for his will, now has shifted away from that light and turned the ability into a darkened self gratification.

Dark forces will use you and your abilities to fulfill their will, if you give them only the smallest crack to enter the picture.

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Thu Nov 17, 2022 7:49 am

The Parable from the Indians is the Door of all Doors available to us while still in the body, I think, but so many are afraid.

We, of our generation who seek understanding, have encountered the New Age teaching.
An idea that is exactly right and precisely wrong at the same time.

John 10: 31 Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him. 32 Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me? 33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God. 34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods? 35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken; 36 say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God? 37 If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not. 38 But if I do, though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the Father is in me, and I in him.

They grab vs. 34 and never read to vs 36. And skip the lesson of
the Garden altogether.

People WANT it to work, but they take the Power to be themselves,
never understanding it is a continuous act of total submission that brings the promotion.

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Subject: Re: The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation Thu Nov 17, 2022 12:19 pm

I picked up this line, ScaRZ..
The more miracles that are seen, or used upon people, it can take away from just pure "Faith".
-------------
Faith is an action verb. The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 1f60a

  It doesn't stand alone.
"Well, I have faith." Faith in what? Faith for what?
Faith is the substance.
Miracles are surely the evidence of Faith.
Jesus said we will do all that He did, and MORE....
it is God showing Himself as the ALL IN ALL, the Great
I AM.
When we read the Hebrew Names of God is scripture,
we see HE wants us to know Him as our Ever Present,
Ever Faithful Giver of every Blessing.

Notwithstanding "All who call upon the Name of the Lord will
be saved," faith that yields nothing is a Promise left on the
ground. Never planted, watered, given Light. And produces
no fruit.

For those who are truly 'born again', transformed by the
Indwelling Spirit, live in Spirit and in Truth; in the Kingdom
of Eternity, able to do 'Good works' and yield 'much Fruit',
Faith is both the substance and evidence of Answered
Prayer.

SUBSTANCE. Let that Word reveal its meaning. It's a key to
understanding the Source of the Good Outcome from the transition the world is now embarked on.

See if this fits. We are born of water, and look up and out
for God and His World. We are in the valley, praying to the
'Mountain top' concealed by clouds, to God on His Throne.

We are born a second time of Spirit, and God's Kingdom is no
longer afar off, but we WAKE UP to the Truth that He dwells within us, where we can meet with Him every day, as He instructed.

The world is OPPOSITE right now from the Kingdom. God's
Ways and Laws are not those of the world.
BUT they still possess ALL AUTHORITY on earth and in Heaven
WHEREVER God is.
And God IS on the earth in His Prepared Temple=you and me.
God is Spirit. We know Him by His Spirit within.
"The Day will come when all will worship in SPIRIT AND IN
TRUTH'.
The Spirit guides us in all Truth, and CONFORMS us to the
Image and Likeness of Christ Jesus.

To REMAIN in that Sacred Union (Unity), we must acknowledge that HE Alone is God, and DO what He says
DO, and don't do what He says 'Don't do that, Don't say
that, Don't go there.'

And the voice of the Tempter pops up. 'Oh, it's okay, you
can handle it.' There is only one answer for that: Get
behind me, satan.
There are consequences for disobedience. Being cut off
or separated from the Spirit and His Fruit is TERRIBLE.

We obey=walk in accordance with all that He teaches us.
With the innocence of a child we accept that If He says it, that settles it.
AND we ASK. He said to. And come BOLDLY before the
Throne.

John 15:7 - If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.

John 16:24 - Hitherto have ye asked nothing in my name: ask, and ye shall receive, that your joy may be full.

Psalms 37:4 - Delight thyself also in the LORD; and he shall give thee the desires of thine heart.

And many more verses:
God is a Good Giver. If there is something you lack, and you can
handle having it-including giving it away again if He chooses to,
He will not deny you !!
Just give Him all the Glory-and in this way honor Him, share His Love,
and help enlarge the Kingdom.

https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/Bible-Verses-About-Ask-And-You-Shall-Receive/

The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation - Page 9 1f60a

   I want to know the thoughts of God. Everything else is just details.
     A Miracle is when God makes His Reality our Experience

Elite Posts : 1954 Reputation : 62 Join date : 2012-01-05

This is the faith I'm referring to. This is the closest that the Bible comes to offering an exact definition of faith. Read the whole chapter and it fits like a glove.

Hebrews 11:1........"Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen."

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