The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation

I'm with you on the 'awareness' of the Presence of God within.  It is recognizable.  So is that
person with the Spirit still just an 'ordinary' person'?     Or is that an oxymoron. 
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One of the main arguments I encounter on social media is that it's impossible to have peace on earth while having conflicting religious beliefs.  I don't think that's valid.

But  one major objection most hold against Christianity is that we confront the world as
"If you don't come to God through Jesus, you're going to hell."

Non Christians find that both insulting and arbitrary.  And it REALLY hardens their hearts against the Gospel.
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Thoughts> Mostly along the lines of how do we come to peace and remain steadfast in our beliefs?
Keep in mind that the alternative the world is flirting with is the NWO-UN 'religion', which might even come to pass (for a time).

Anytime we try to "Force" feed, that is much different than feeding. Look back to Genesis and the fruit the serpent offers Eve. The fruit was never forced upon Eve. She reached out and took the fruit and consumed it by her on free will. 

The very same thing goes for "Feeding" of The Gospel". Jesus Christ held strong to preaching, teaching, and prophesying The Gospel, but never forced fed it. Even the "Sheep" were fed The Gospel, never was it forced down their throats. Believers are to sow the seed out into the earth. The sun and the rain give life to the seed and produce fruit.

Matthew 24:14........"And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come."


Revelation 14:6........"And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,"

The LORD will continue trying to reach people. 

The end of this age will not come until this is fulfilled. Even within the days of much tribulation The LORD will make sure his good news (The Gospel) is spread throughout the whole earth. The people of this earth will be without excuse. What one chooses to do with the good news is up to them.

You can look back at the Days of Noah and see The LORD finally came to a point that the door was closed. One day that door will close again.

Jesus Christ when speaking of the wheat and the tares tells us how both come up together, but one day a separation will occur.

I believe a short time just before the coming of Jesus Christ will be a very dark time for this earth. 

Not everyone who hears the gospel (Good News) will be saved. No where can you find in scripture that everyone who hears the gospel (Good News) will be saved.

Everyone will not be right. All paths do not lead to the same destination. 

Exactly.  I was presented with a 'strawman' argument,  and always severely limited space to write out a response.

I have seen Christians come barreling in, ready to chop off the tongues of unbelievers.
They must regard "Love for all" as compromise.  

Some, with a real voice and audience, consider Christians responsible for the warring condition of the world due to our perceived rigidness. And that's nonsense.

THEN, and this is interesting, the New Age 'Enlightened' folks who focus on being co-creators
of the earth experience, blame Christians for believing in the Book of Revelation, and that WE, in our beliefs, are bringing these circumstances onto the earth.   

I've read 'the Bible is a book of war'. (looking to the OT, obviously).  And any explanation is dismissed as 'brainwashing'. That's what was said to me. lol.

Yet these astute people do not blame the Hidden hand-the enemy of God, when it comes to pitting brother against brother.  

Job says something very interesting about Leviathen in Job 41:10........"None is so fierce that dare stir him up: who then is able to stand before me?"

"None is so fierce that stir him up"..........It fits very well with what Revelation 13:4 says about The Beast that rises up out of the sea. 

Revelation 13:4........"And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?"

This powerful beast is beyond human control, ferocious, dangerous, full of the power and spirit of Satan,  seeking to devour. 

I believe God was telling Job that Leviathan was indeed fierce but even as dangerous as the beast is God has the power to destroy him or anyone or anything else.

I'm looking at the symbolic and spiritual meaning of Leviathan.

The 144,000 that are referred to as "virgins" in Revelation 14, are those who remain pure. These 144,000 carry with them the seal/mark/name/number of God The Father. They remain a virgin and await The Bridegroom. 

We as believers and followers are to remain a virgin, we are to remain a waiting bride, until The Bridegroom arrives. At that point in time the virgin bride (The Church/The Body of Christ) marries The Bridegroom and becomes his wife. 

The Bridegroom Jesus Christ is able to present her (His Bride) to himself as radiant without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless.

Ephesians 5:25-27

Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

Revelation 14:4 is speaking of the 144,000 as being virgins not defiled with women. In The Bible at times a pure woman is a type of the pure church; a wicked woman is a type of a false church.

Revelation 14:4

These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.

Tim gave a very good tribute to Tom Horn in this video. Tom was one of my biggest influencers for over fifteen years. I always thought a lot for Tom's work and he will be missed. The passing of Michael Heiser and Tom Horn in the last few months leaves a deep hole, but their great work will not be lost.

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Peru Alien Expedition and a Tribute to Tom Horn

I have found this website (by chance   ) a couple of times now while researching, and so far I think it's VERY good.

https://www.compellingtruth.org

Charles Lawson was talking about this in one of his latest sermons.   I remember Mike talking about this too.  Lawson was one of Mike's favorites . I'll try to find that sermon -
 It's been a hectic time here on the farm.  but I have to tell ya'll about  some folks that came by from Denmark to see the place.. It was a family of 5 - mother ,father and 3 teenagers.  Well, they were very nice and down to earth . They were here barely over an hour as they had an appointment in N.O. so had to leave.. But near the end of the tour, the subject of our religious faith came up and my bil answered Methodist, then the middle teen looked at me and asked  in English "and are you Methodist too?" I said "no , I'm non denominational."   she immediately almost ran to me and was very interested in what that meant. I told her that I didn't like saying the apostles creed in that church,  and  that I believed Jesus was the only way to Heaven- ,no pope nor apostles, nor prosperity preachers.. ,just Jesus. That I believed in the Bible and spent my time when not working studying it/Jesus  so I could go there etc.. Then she asked in stilted English "so you are not happy?" . I said "Yes, I have a wonderful life but I want to go to Heaven and believing in Jesus is the only way to the Father," 
 Writing this ,I left out some of the conversation such as some things that have happened to me,  but did tell her about the  gentle touch I felt on my back as I  was bent over crying as I loaded things into my Mama's car trunk in Arkansas, right after she passed  unexpectedly11 years ago . I had turned around and found no one there. I emphasized there was a touch and it wasn't just material moving on my shirt. Her eyes got as big as saucers and I could tell that  she wanted to be a believer too. Time was up and they had to leave .. Not enough time and I can't remember names well. I've been praying for this young lady (likely 16? ) Please pray for  her also.   I wish I had given her more down to earth names to follow on You tube.. As she was leaving she said so "Charles Lawson!" and I said "yes that's right." and smiled. Again I should have said Gary Hammick and Jack Hibbs...  at least .. I sure regret that I didn't give her these  slightly younger preachers of the word.

No way to contact them again, BC?  How did they find you to begin with?

No Dove. No record of how they found us nor phone number..  I think they likely called us from the visitor's  bureau  pamphlet of historic places in this area. I have at least planted  some seed.  The Lord can put it in her heart to reach out perhaps. I'm praying for that..

Yes ma'am.  Nothing happens by accident.    And you fulfilled the moment.

It is more than enough.  Very cool!   

ScaRZ wrote:

Michael and I talked about Satan and Lucifer a few times. I do not think they are one and the same. That is where I changed a few years ago and to this day remain. 

The word Lucifer is Latin, and it means “morning star.” It comes from the Greek heōsphoros, which means “bringer of dawn.” Both refer to the planet Venus, which can be seen at dawn, hence the nicknames.

Also important is Jesus also referred to himself as the “morning star” in Revelation 22:16........“I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things for the churches. I am the root and the descendant of David, the bright morning star.”

Isaiah 14 is about a fallen, Babylonian king........"A Man".

Isaiah 14:16........"They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms;

Satan (The Adversary) is not a man, he isn't even part man to be called a man. I can't find anywhere in scripture where Satan is referred to as a human being. But The Adversary's offspring could be referred to as a man if he was born of a human woman.

Genesis 3:15........"And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel."

This whole lay out (Isaiah 14) is about one being (The King of Babylon) it never changes from one individual (Man) to a different entity (Satan/The Adversary).

The serpent has a seed just as the woman has a seed......."Offspring". These two seeds will oppose one another. 

(The Antichrist) is The Evil Seed that will oppose The Good Seed (Our Lord Jesus Christ.)

Christ vs Antichrist

Below is from the Septuagint and I believe this leads us all the way back to the seed of the serpent that is written about in Genesis 3. 

(Esaias 14:20,Isaiah).........."As a garment defiled with blood shall not be pure, so neither shalt thou be pure; because thou hast destroyed my land, and hast slain my people: thou shalt not endure for ever—thou an evil seed. "

The Greek reading of the last part stands out even brighter in my opinion.........(ou me meines eis ton aiona kronon sperma poneron)........"In no way should you abide into the eon of time –seed of evil”

I believe The King of Babylon is the evil seed. He is the seed of the serpent whose birth was predicted in Genesis 3:15, who stands opposed to Jesus, the seed of the woman.

If The Antichrist (The King of Babylon) is the literal son of Satan (The Adversary) then he is a hybrid.

To me 'the man' is indeed a man, the antichrist, possessed by the spirit of the one who intended to rule the earth, to sit on the Most High. 

Was Lucifer 'the bright and morning star' before the sin of pride entered in and brought about his fall?

Jesus witnessed his fall, when He also was in heaven. Not when He was on the earth. 
Memory says Lucifer was charged with serving man, and he was
greatly offended by that.

When Lucifer was cast down to the earth, he lost claim to all his position, his title, and his NAME.  He was henceforth known as satan, the tempter and deceiver of man. 
The title/description of the Morning Star passed to Jesus on account of His Faithful obedience to God. He fulfilled the Designation of the Bright and Morning Star.
================

This supports what I have believed all these years:

The Lord speaks this about Satan, “You were the anointed cherub who covers; I established (created) you; You were on the holy mountain of God; You were perfect in your ways from the day you were created, Till INIQUITY (sin) WAS FOUND IN YOU. Your heart was lifted up because of your beauty; You corrupted your wisdom for the sake of your splendor; I cast you to the ground…” (Ezekiel 28:14-17) When originally created by God, Lucifer, like everything else God created was perfect. Not only that, he seemed to have been especially beautiful. The anointed cherub who covers, indicates that Lucifer held a position of superiority over all the other angels. Being the “anointed cherub” speaks of the highest position among the cherubim. The phrase “that covered” tells us that the cherubim overshadowed the Ark of the Covenant – a position next to the presence of God. The perfection of Lucifer is again stressed. There was no defect in him until HE CHOSE TO SIN. He, like everything God created, was perfect.
“HOW YOU ARE FALLEN from heaven, O Lucifer (now Satan, the devil), son of the morning…For you have said in your heart:


[*]I will ascend into heaven,
[*]I will exalt my throne above the stars of God;
[*]I will also sit on the mount of the congregation
[*]I will ascend above the heights of the clouds,
[*]I will be like the Most High.
[*]


(Isaiah 14:12-14)
From this passage we see a description of the original fall of Satan. We learn much about him as a person. He was the anointed cherub who had a special place next to the throne of God. Because of his special place, and his extraordinary beauty, he was LIFTED UP WITH PRIDE. This caused him to rebel against God, and to be judged for his sin
https://cogop.org/devotions/2020/02/11/the-five-i-wills-of-satan/ 

I was looking for a vid to watch and came upon Heiser.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2QM7anD5vSI  at 1 hr 11 mins.

In those last minutes he referenced the morning star, found in Revelation 2:

26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations: 
27 and he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father. 
28 And I will give him the morning star. 
29 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

I checked the Thayer's Greek Lexicon for more clues:

Jesus speaking, delivering the message to the churches to John (you know)
Revelation 2:28 (δώσω αὐτῷ τὸν ἀστέρα τ. πρωϊνόν I will give to him the morning star, that he may be irradiated with its splendor and outshine all others, i. e. I will cause his heavenly glory to excel that of others)

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That brings me to think even more that it is a description/designation/title of position and 'condition of glory' rather than the name of an entity.  


The minister on the vid as well says
"the morning star is symbolic of the reign of the messiah'.


Then Michael says, "Jesus is the morning star.  That's a title for
the reigning Messiah."  Jesus proclaims it also in Rev 22:16

There are scholars who believe Isaiah 14 is speaking of King Nebuchadnezzar.
This prophecy in my opinion can not be ruled out to be The King of Babylon Nebuchadnezzar. Can this also be a dual prophecy?

We must read the whole chapter of Isaiah 14 to understand the full picture of what is taking place. I will not post it all here, but will leave a link to it. Read any version of your choosing.

https://www.blbclassic.org/Bible.cfm?b=Isa&c=14&v=1&t=KJV#top

No where in scripture can you find anywhere that "The Adversary" (Satan) is ever referred to as Lucifer. This is the only place in The Bible where the Latin word Lucifer is found. This is the only Latin word that was never translated to Greek. The Adversary (Satan) was never given the title of "Morning Star/Bringer of Dawn" anywhere in The Bible. 

This King of Babylon thinks of himself as being "Like The Most High"...........He views himself as The Morning Star/Bringer of Dawn.

As we can read on downward in Isaiah 14, this King of Babylon at his death and entering the realm of the dead is mocked by the other kings who are in the realm of the dead. This whole lay out is a mocking these kings are tossing back at this King of Babylon for thinking he was anything more than what they were. These dead realm kings are saying........."How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! (They are mocking him!) how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!........For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:........I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High."


(My words in orange.)


We also need to remember something very important. Throughout the history of The World there have been antichrist (Not The Antichrist) and adversaries (Not The Adversary).

I went back and searched my old emails  Mike had sent concerning this topic and this one  video he linked to is no longer available.. I'm hoping I copied them but I have a huge box and some labeled poorly. I do still have the name he sent.. Dr. Heather Lynn  OWRN interview   I plan to dig up his other ones too.. I'm looking forward to viewing yours also.

I never viewed either one of these videos before I placed in this thread my thinking on the subject of Lucifer and Satan. I think both of these men have given some very good thoughts on the subject. I think they lay things out and then give their opinions. The second video is longer, and goes much deeper into the whole subject. Both are very well done, and give me much to study.

Is there anywhere in the bible where Satan is called Lucifer? Dr. Robert M. Price






Is the Fall of Satan really described in the Bible? With Dr. Peter Gentry

After listening to Dr. Gentry he brought into the conversation his thoughts on the knowledge of good and evil. It certainly hit home for me when thinking of the big picture from the beginning on through our earthly history.

When I look at Adam (The Man), I see him as having authority by The LORD God to rule earth.

Adam chose the wrong tree. Adam chose to not do The Will of God but chose The Knowledge of Good and Evil. Instead of leaving it in the hands of The LORD God to weigh good and evil, Adam chose to weigh what is good and what is evil by his on hand. That's what it all comes to if we look closely.

I think back to The Tower of Babel and I see again that the builders of the tower no longer desired to listen to the voice of The LORD God, and do his will.........They wanted to make a name for who???..... "Ourselves". Just like Adam they chose to weigh for themselves what is good and what is evil.

Genesis 11:4........They said, “Come, let us build for ourselves a city, and a tower whose top will reach into heaven, and let us make for ourselves a name, otherwise we will be scattered abroad over the face of the whole earth.”

How many times over and over did Jesus speak of doing The Will of The Father. Jesus did The Will of The Father, not his will. I remember when Jesus was praying to The Father about the fast approaching of his death in Matthew 26.

Matthew 26:39........"And he went a little further, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt."

Many times we forget Jesus was a man also. Jesus never chose to weigh by his own hands......."Jesus did The Will of The Father". 

What do we see in all the earths history of mankind?........"Not doing The Will of The LORD God, but our own will." We chose, we choose to weigh for ourselves what is good and what is evil........"The Tree of The Knowledge of Good and Evil."

bordercollie wrote:

I went back and searched my old emails  Mike had sent concerning this topic and this one  video he linked to is no longer available.. I'm hoping I copied them but I have a huge box and some labeled poorly. I do still have the name he sent.. Dr. Heather Lynn  OWRN interview   I plan to dig up his other ones too.. I'm looking forward to viewing yours also.

Did you have any luck finding anything? If you did, post some of it. I did look on Youtube, and saw a few videos with Dr. Heather Lynn, but there wasn't much of anything I thought you may have been referring to.

ScaRZ . . .

You might wanna be thinking about a name for the next iteration of this thread. Apparently (if what recently happened on the 'latest intel' topic) the forum software will max out at around 20 pages and 990 replies and automatically lock, and this thread is getting close to that limit.

Meanwhile, are you keeping up with what Israel is doing (total genocide) to Gaza? You might want to check some of the threads in the lower section. Start with October Tidbits - last post to that thread. Small wonder that in the last days (if that is where we are time-wise) that the whole world turns on the Jews (Khazarians) and goes after Israel. So much is happening prophetically over there.

researcher wrote:

ScaRZ . . .

You might wanna be thinking about a name for the next iteration of this thread. Apparently (if what recently happened on the 'latest intel' topic) the forum software will max out at around 20 pages and 990 replies and automatically lock, and this thread is getting close to that limit.

Meanwhile, are you keeping up with what Israel is doing (total genocide) to Gaza? You might want to check some of the threads in the lower section. Start with October Tidbits - last post to that thread. Small wonder that in the last days (if that is where we are time-wise) that the whole world turns on the Jews (Khazarians) and goes after Israel. So much is happening prophetically over there.

Thanks Researcher for the heads up on the thread. I will create a new one very soon. The past I have created new ones after it reached 10,000 views.

Anytime Researcher you want to post something in the thread please do so. I really look forward for members posting in the thread. It can help branch things in a new direction, a well as breath new life into the thread.

Also while I'm thinking about it, you can lock this thread as you have the others when I start the new one.

Thank you Researcher for all you do.