The Bible, Tribulation, Revelation

Dove wrote:

Dan is an incredible talent.   

Yes! Dan is an awesome singer. With his voice he can move from low to high notes and then smooth it like butter.

Our DNA can be likened to the code of a computer program. The Human DNA is a biological internet. 

Think about this and it all comes together. God knows us by our name......"What is our name?".......We are all unique individuals, our name is our unique DNA sequence.

Psalm 139:16........"Your eyes have seen my unformed substance;
And in Your book were all written
The days that were ordained for me,
When as yet there was not one of them."

Paul hit the nail on the head. 

If I were the devil | remastered audio | Paul Harvey

2 Thessalonians 2:2 is where Paul is warning people to not believe and be deceived that The Day of The Lord has come. In the very next verse Paul points to two things that must occur before The Day of The Lord can become true........"Apostasy and The Man of Lawlessness is revealed, The Son of Destruction."

2 Thessalonians 2:2-3


that you not be quickly shaken from your composure or be disturbed either by a spirit or a message or a letter as if from us, to the effect that the day of the Lord has come.


Let no one in any way deceive you, for it will not come unless the apostasy comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction,

Later in verses 6-7 we read that The Man of Sin is being restrained until a time when the restraining will end.

2 Thessalonians 2:6-7


And you know what restrains him now, so that in his time he will be revealed.


For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only he who now restrains will do so until he is taken out of the way.

Here below is some great material from someone that I totally agree with. I've had the same viewpoint for many years. He lays it out in such an excellent way that it's easy to follow. I don't know his real name so I'll just use his "Screen-Name"........Thank you ICA!!


ICA Wrote:


Who is restraining the “man of lawlessness”? Is it the Holy Spirit or the Body of Christ as is often claimed? I find no evidence for that in Scripture at all. But I do find strong evidence of something else entirely.


When Paul told the Christians of Thessalonica about the revealing of the “man of lawlessness”, the one “Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God” (2:4) he was obviously alluding directly to the Prophet Daniel (Daniel 11:36-37) who spoke of the exact same event:


Dan 11:36-37, “And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods … for he shall magnify himself above all.”


In fact, Paul even continues by saying, “Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?” (2:5). Told them what things? The things that were written in the Book of Daniel. Keep in mind that up until then, the Old Testament was their only Scriptural reference to draw from. After Paul reminds them that he told them these things from the Book of Daniel, he then continues, “And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time” (2:6). So, given the fact that Paul references the end of Daniel 11, what else does Daniel say that Paul’s words would have caused them to remember? A few verses later Daniel writes:


Dan 12:1, “At that time Michael shall stand up, The great prince who stands watch over the sons of your people; And there shall be a time of trouble, Such as never was since there was a nation, Even to that time. And at that time your people shall be delivered, Every one who is found written in the book.”


Here we discover that Archangel Michael has watched over the people of God throughout history and even today, but that a time would come when Michael will “stand up”. The Hebrew word for “stand up” in Dan 12:1 is “amad” (H5975) and it means “to stand aside or stand still, stop (moving or doing), to cease.” How do we know that this is the intended meaning? The context. We know because after Michael does this we read about “a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation, even to that time”.


Bingo. This should immediately sound familiar to us. 2 Thess 2:7 says “For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way.” As was mentioned above, the word “ginomai” need not mean removal by an outside force, but rather removal through a determined act on the part of the subject. The Restrainer moves himself out of the way or the midst by stepping aside or getting out from in between, and once he does this THEN the “lawless one” will be revealed (2 Thess 2:8}. Look at what Jesus says in Matthew 24:15,21:


Matt 24:14,21, “When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place … then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.”


This is exactly what the prophet Daniel said would happen when Michael steps aside, that “there shall be a time of trouble, Such as never was since there was a nation, even to that time,” and I believe that this is precisely what Paul reminded the Christians of Thessalonica about so that they would remember.


Because of this, I believe that the restrainer is therefore Archangel Michael, and when the time comes for Michael to “amad”, all hell breaks loose. Literally.

All right peeps, up for debate. Anyone heard about, or know anything about this United Nations 7 year plan? This little missive appeared in this weeks compass mailing (link and screenshot below) and is the first I’ve heard of this anywhere. The things that make a body go hmmm…
 
Compass is a pre-trib oriented publication. I don't agree with their rapture view but they do have some other good stuff.

Hmmm?
 
https://compass.org/the-biggest-danger-to-mankind/
 

 
And below is the article linked where the screenshot above says to “click here”.
 
https://www.jonathanbrentner.com/https/jonathan-brentner-g8fgsquarespacecom/config/2023/6/27/is-the-uns-proposed-seven-year-plan-prophetically-significant

Excerpt below - more at the link above.

They've changed their agenda date so many times, they probably don't know what it is.

Here's this countdown from yesterday or 2 days ago

I  enjoy listening to  these folks .  The daughter has some interesting biblical historical  videos . Give it a 28 minutes  or go to the her section at the 12 minute mark.

Revelation 13 and the beast coming up out of the earth I believe to be The False Prophet is given power that blows my mind.

I have believed for some time now that this beast could be more than a human.  

The two verses that are above interesting are 14-15.

Revelation 13:14-15


And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.



As we can read he or it is given this ability to do signs in the presence or by the authority of the first beast. This second beast tells those who dwell on earth to make an image to the first beast. I have wondered for many years what this image could be. Most seem to believe it is a statue but I think it could be something much more. 

We humans were created to image God......."In other words we are to be Imagers of God." This isn't just about an outward appearance, but most importantly to image his very character......"In The Image of God". Jesus Christ was the perfect example of a true "Imager of God". I believe this image that those who dwell on earth are to make is accomplished by.....A mixing of DNA...Genetics.... of the first beast. This image is an Imager of The First Beast......"In The Image of The Beast".

As it is written......."If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb."

And it was given to him to give life (breath) to the image of the beast, so that the image of the beast would even speak and cause as many as do not worship the image of the beast to be killed.

Believe it or not this second beast is then given the ability or power to give Breath to this Imager of The First Beast. Remember when God gave the breath of life to Adam?......"When this occurred Adam (The Man) became a living soul." We now see this second beast gives the breath of life to this Imager of The First Beast. The False Prophet is given the power to bring this Imager to life and can now speak because he is alive and people are now to serve or worship this Imager who was brought to life by this False Prophet.

In my opinion this is almost unbelievable.

It takes time in search of truth and I wonder how many of us humans really hunger for something outside of the box we live in. It's the same no matter how far we look back throughout history. We humans suffer from a lack of deep interest and desire quick satisfaction. 

This life is a great wilderness lacking understanding the many mysteries of the ages. A vast wilderness of doubts, questions, trials and tribulations that mold us into the souls we are, as well as who we will become. Into this great wilderness we all came and one day through the giant maze of life a path will finally lead us to the promise land of understanding.

When "The Eternal" creates New Heavens what will they be filled with? Will it be only the New Adam and the heavenly host that reside with him now, or will they also be populated with massive newer creations as well?

Michael and I brought up a few times the subject of a Pre-Adamic world (age). Michael as well as Doug (A friend) were in very much the same line of agreement on the subject. I had studied a little on the topic but never got beyond a small dip into the subject. Both Michael and Doug got me more interested.

Most certainly if there was a Pre-Adamic creation it doesn't mean this creation were "Imagers of God". We know Man (Adam) was created in The Image of God but as of that World (Age) there appears no evidence to support that fact.

The Bible in a few verses can lead us to thinking maybe there could have been an Age (World) with inhabitants before The World (Age) of Adam (Man). I read in Genesis that God told Adam the very same thing as he told Noah........"God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth {Adam}........Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth."{Noah}.

Replenish means to fill it up, but also to restore it.

We certainly can understand in Noah's case, but why in Adam's case. What was Adam restoring? Noah was both multiplying and restoring the earth. Adam was multiplying but what was he restoring? 

and that's just for June......   Extreme  straight line winds of 80 mph here  during a weather front in June and it was the second one. Extreme heat  also.  Certainly  looks and sounds like "perilous times" we are warned of .

bordercollie wrote:

and that's just for June......   Extreme  straight line winds of 80 mph here  during a weather front in June and it was the second one. Extreme heat  also.  Certainly  looks and sounds like "perilous times" we are warned of .

We can certainly see over the last few years just the weather alone is trying to tell us something. The heat buildup of the earth is a sign of more "perilous times".

An open mind can and will be used as a gathering of good and bad. There must be a filtering or any and everything gets in. Much like the topic of The Restrainer......."Without restraining all the dirt pours in."

Does anybody even pay attention to this guy anymore? Inquiring minds want to know. Cahn has a dismal track record. Wanna bet there’ll be a new book forthcoming? Oh, wait... there already is one.

DISCERN!
 

https://www.onenewspage.com/video/20230712/15946545/Jonathan-Cahn-The-Demonic-Ritualistic-Root-of-Abortion.htm

I did hear an interview discussing his new book. We're just far ahead of him; not in his niche.
But there certainly are people who never considered the demonic so active now, and hopefully
he woke up that group who does follow him. 

There's a very long list of people we should be praying for.

researcher wrote:

Does anybody even pay attention to this guy anymore? Inquiring minds want to know. Cahn has a dismal track record. Wanna bet there’ll be a new book forthcoming? Oh, wait... there already is one.

I don't pay any attention to him. 

There are some who want us to purchase all the time.

I once liked hearing him especially when  I  heard his first video on the trade centers and the  similarities to things in the Bible, I'll still listen  if it catches my interest... but  as soon as  it becomes a " money thing " then I have no desire to hear that person  .

This below is written by ICA......And I agree with him completely. He did give permission for posting the material.

*************************************

I believe that a Christian’s salvation is ‘eternally secure’ only IF they remain in Christ. They can, of their own free will, still fall away from the faith and lose their salvation. If they remain in Christ, their salvation can never be lost. I am sure that all of us here would agree that everyone who is saved by grace has their name written in the Book of Life. Galatians tells us about those who left the faith of Christ, and it tells us what happens:


Gal 5:4, “You have become estranged from Christ, you who attempt to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.”


They whom Paul refers to could not have fallen from grace if they were not saved by grace to begin with. They did not endure in the faith. They did not overcome the temptation to revert back to the old law {cf Gal 5:8}. In doing so they were no longer covered by His blood, and their garments have been defiled. At one time they were saved by grace when they believed, but in leaving Christ they lost their salvation as a consequence, for grace cannot save when there is no longer faith. They would be among those who “believe for awhile”, but later fell away (Luke 8:13).


The possibility of apostasy is very evident in Scripture, especially Hebrews, and there are several warnings regarding this: a warning against drifting (Heb 2:1-4), a warning against departing (Heb 3:12-14), a warning against disobedience (Heb 4:11), and a warning against dullness, leading to apostasy (Heb 5:11-6:6). The apostles knew very well what Jesus meant when He said, “Anyone who parts from me is thrown away like a useless branch and withers. Such branches are gathered into a pile to be burned.” (John 15:6). Indeed, but Jesus declares “He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments, and I will not blot out his name from the Book of Life; but I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels” (Rev 3:5). If this verse is true, then the inverse is also true: “He who does not overcome shall not be clothed in white garments, and I will blot out his name from the Book of Life.”




Very important what ICA continues to explain below.


We should not look at salvation in terms of whether we ‘believe enough’ or not. We are saved by grace the instant we begin to believe in Messiah. Just look at the thief who hung on the cross next to Jesus. He showed an ounce of faith by simply asking Jesus to remember him, and Jesus saved his soul (Luke 23:42-43). How much more true can this be for those who confess with their lips that Jesus Christ is Lord?


For those who fall away from the faith, the problem comes not when they are tempted or when they have a question or when they have a doubt about something. The problem comes when they make the conscious decision to reject the Gospel and fall away from faith in Jesus to then believe in anything other than the Gospel of Grace, and they remain in that spiritual condition at the time of their death. It is upon death, I believe, that the determination is made whether one’s name remains in the Book of Life, or is blotted out (cf Rev 3:5). I do not believe that a name is erased to only then be re-written in and erased yet again multiple times just because they experience times of struggle.

Genesis 1:2........"And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters."

How could there be darkness that was spoken of in Genesis 1:2?........(I believe The Adversary had now fallen and darkness spread outward into creation.) Think about it......."Darkness is the absence of Light."........ In God there is no darkness only Light.

When the New Jerusalem comes down from God out of heaven there will be no night (No Darkness).

Revelation 21:23........"And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof."


Revelation 21:25........"And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there."


Revelation 22:5........"And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light: and they shall reign for ever and ever."


1 Thessalonians 5:5........"Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness."

True believers and followers of Jesus Christ are the children of Light (God),not the children of darkness (The Adversary).

I most certainly believe The Adversary as well as The Heavenly Host who rebelled and became adversaries of God, all their destinies were sealed in The Lake of Fire a long time ago. They now continually seek a way around their fate. 

In the Book of Enoch the 200 Watchers that took wives were divided into ten groups it appears, with each group having a leader over them. 

Where does this story sound familiar?

None other than that of the Beast of Revelation (The Antichrist) when he is a king of kings over ten kings who are given power by the Antichrist (The Beast) to rule over ten kingdoms.

And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone. (Revelation 19:20)

As we read, the beast isn't just a World System it is a "HIM". The beast is The Antichrist and he along with the false prophet will both be cast "Alive" into the lake of fire.

The Bible is very plain that only through Jesus Christ can we obtain eternal life.

He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. (1John 5:12)

If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned. (1John 5:12)

And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire. (Revelation 20:15)

I believe the Lake of Fire could be the earth as it burns........"Then later a new heaven, as well as a new earth will take form as a rebirth occurs.

I hear often about how some of scripture is corrupt. If scripture is corrupt in places........."How would we know which verses aren't corrupt and which are?" Mankind attempting to figure that out would be exactly what The Adversary has planted in their minds. People would just go in and say, "I like this, I believe this is good scripture....."Lets keep it!!

Then there are others that certain words of scripture offend them......."Well now this offends me,  just doesn't sound like a loving God"......"Lets blot these verses out, and while we are at it, this whole chapter is very offensive.....Remove it."

When it gets to the point where someone decides if words and verses stay in or are deleted out, the ticking of the clock draws close for the arrival of The Man of Sin.

It will soon be where a minister, teacher or just a person like you and I won't be able to say anything that doesn't offend someone. If you read out loud from the Bible you will need to skip over or duck certain words that offend people. Just look and listen, those days are here. Very, very sad days we are now living in.

I needed my dose of this thread today.  It does appear like scripture is slowly being changed so I like to reference older editions of the Bible.  I like to be able to compare verses - such as with E sword.    I'd like to go beyond that even and need to do that instead of just saying it.
  We are already having to be very careful of our language usage and it will get worse until we can't voice opinions at all. Times have changed dramatically in just, I'd say, 10 years. Mike was a firm believer in this happening also.
 ( I have to  tell ya'll something that happened  this Spring in my garden- Mike always grew cabbages from seed - I never ever have planted any. .. well this Spring right there in the front row was a single cabbage plant..  It grew into a nice cabbage....)   
  Lot of things going on in the world slowly trying to turn us away ..  but then something catches your eye and you know  to keep your eyes open and stay aware..

bordercollie wrote:

I needed my dose of this thread today.  It does appear like scripture is slowly being changed so I like to reference older editions of the Bible.  I like to be able to compare verses - such as with E sword.    I'd like to go beyond that even and need to do that instead of just saying it.
  We are already having to be very careful of our language usage and it will get worse until we can't voice opinions at all. Times have changed dramatically in just, I'd say, 10 years. Mike was a firm believer in this happening also.
 ( I have to  tell ya'll something that happened  this Spring in my garden- Mike always grew cabbages from seed - I never ever have planted any. .. well this Spring right there in the front row was a single cabbage plant..  It grew into a nice cabbage....)   
  Lot of things going on in the world slowly trying to turn us away ..  but then something catches your eye and you know  to keep your eyes open and stay aware..

I really miss Mike. He was someone I respected very much. Mike didn't play around....."He stood strong and never held back what needed to be said."

This generation gets too offended and in my opinion appears to enjoy placing labels on people.  They have a desire for everybody to fit inside their small box thinking. 

Just vision when this generation takes over full control.

I can't and never will rule out the possibility that God is an eternal  creator. Just because God created man doesn't mean there are not others who were before man, and how do we possibly know others have not or will not follow man. We certainly understand we were not the first because of those who occupy the heavenly realm.

What I've read and heard from many people is they seem to believe man is the center of the whole universe. I believe there is only one center, and that is the Creator of The Whole Universe. Man is a piece of the universe, but there are others also. 

God very well may have had other creations after the Angels, before man other than those of the earth, beast, fowl, creeping things or life in the sea. We may think we know but we don't. 

I believe one day God will give a rebirth or a new creation to all the heavens and the earth. As far as the eye can see everything is in a form of deterioration and or death. All things which are not seen they are eternal, they are of the invisible spiritual realm.

2 Corinthians 4:18

While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

Isaiah 34:4

And all the host of heaven shall be dissolved, and the heavens shall be rolled together as a scroll: and all their host shall fall down, as the leaf falleth off from the vine, and as a falling fig from the fig tree.

Greek Septuagint LXX (Isaiah 14:12-20)


"12 How has Lucifer, that rose in the morning, fallen from heaven! He that sent orders to all the nations is crushed to the earth. 13 But thou saidst in thine heart, I will go up to heaven, I will set my throne above the stars of heaven: I will sit on a lofty mount, on the lofty mountains toward the north: 14 I will go up above the clouds: I will be like the Most High. 15 But now thou shalt go down to hell, even to the foundations of the earth. 16 They that see thee shall wonder at thee, and say, This is the man that troubled the earth, that made kings to shake; 17 that made the whole world desolate, and destroyed its cities; he loosed not those who were in captivity. 18 All the kings of the nations lie in honour, every man in his house. 19 But thou shalt be cast forth on the mountains, as a loathed carcase, with many dead who have been pierced with swords, going down to the grave. 20 As a garment defiled with blood shall not be pure, so neither shalt thou be pure; because thou hast destroyed my land, and hast slain my people: thou shalt not endure for ever, —thou an evil seed."

For several years I have thought Lucifer is not Satan. As it reads above in verse 16 that I underlined......"The Man". How is it that Satan would be a Man? 

The vast majority of people view Lucifer as Satan, but I just don't see it that way now. For me if Lucifer isn't Satan, them who is this man......."that made kings to shake"? 

This evil seed could be The Beast (The Man of Sin, The Antichrist).

As I've written several occasions........"I look for events to play out much differently than how most are viewing it today."

If the teachings are too popular then be very watchful, it could turn out to be nothing more than "Fools Gold." I just can't see The Adversary not having his fingerprints all over the most popular of anything. We need to keep in mind, "Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:" .........Here we see once again that the broad way (Most traveled or most popular way)........"Leads to Destruction". The vast majority of people on this earth will follow where the crowds have gathered.

Perfect to hear this refreshment today. The tares and the wheat lesson ... gets me  back in the spirit every time. Also the pruning of the vine, and then the tree that bears no fruit given more time to show themselves  before being chopped down the next year.  Thank you for this post.

bordercollie wrote:

Perfect to hear this refreshment today. The tares and the wheat lesson ... gets me  back in the spirit every time. Also the pruning of the vine, and then the tree that bears no fruit given more time to show themselves  before being chopped down the next year.  Thank you for this post.

It's good to always have you lay out your thoughts Judy. 

There is just about no interaction anymore without Michael taking part in the thread.

These are some of my thoughts for the questions above.

You and I have no excuse because our opportunity is and has been in full bloom for a long time. We must either accept or reject.

We are not born with an accepting heart we are born with a rejecting heart. No matter who you are or where you are born the war of flesh against spirit is present in all of us.

It just seems to me to be that "Everyone" must come somehow, someway to a point of an opportunity to accept or reject. I certainly do not understand how all this will come to be.

I have wondered for many years if all of this will come to be for those who are "The Rest of the Dead" written about in The Book of Revelation. These are those who will live again, those who were never of the first resurrection. There resurrection takes place after the "The Millennium".

Key point to remember is that Satan is going to be released from The Bottomless Pit "After The Millennium is fulfilled" for a little season of deceiving the nations again. There will be so many in rebellion at the climax of the little season, they will be numbered as "The Sand of the Sea".

Revelation 20:2-3........"And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,........And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season."


Revelation20:4-5........"And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years........But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection."


Revelation 20:6........"Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years."


Revelation 20:7-8........"And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,........And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea."

It's my belief that those wicked people( even those that have never heard of our Lord)   that do evil acts without repenting and changing their ways will not enter Heaven.   I  "accidently" opened this   preacher's video (John Barnett) aka DTBM , during a brief rain this morning.  The 16 minute mark is the same as I think it is.( Nothing unclean in Heaven) - If you have time to listen, the last few minutes when he speaks about the meaning of the Hebrew names from the first edition Scofield Bible is really interesting. ( I always wondered about Methuselah dying and then the flood . 

bordercollie wrote:

It's my belief that those wicked people( even those that have never heard of our Lord)   that do evil acts without repenting and changing their ways will not enter Heaven.  

Yes! how could "Heaven" be any different than this life we are living, if sin is part of it?

This guy that ask me the questions, and they are questions that many people ask every single day. I believe all of us have at sometime ask deep within ourselves questions much in line with his questions.

This guy reads The Bible, believes in God, reads and hears others thoughts on the questions......"But a lot of their, as well as his thoughts and beliefs never fully connect for him......He believes something is missing in how most believers answer the questions."

I also as he, believe we are not getting a true view of the picture that hangs in front of us. I know without a doubt "I" continue to stare at the picture. One day it will come into focus. It may not be in this life I now live, but one day the picture will be fully understood.

I think perhaps, that those people that have never known the Lord will be given the opportunity to change during the last part of the tribulation.   We as believers will not be subject to His wrath and will not be here for it. but these  non believers will be.  It's NOT a second chance but a "wake up call" under horrific conditions for those who NEVER knew Him .  Will  they see the Light before that tribulation time is up or will they go to the  Lake of Fire ?  It will be their choice. Those that knew of Him - and fell away  are doomed to the Lake of fire.  That's the way I see it, but willing to hear other viewpoints.

bordercollie wrote:

I think perhaps, that those people that have never known the Lord will be given the opportunity to change during the last part of the tribulation.   

Maybe I'm not understanding your thinking. Are you saying, you think there will be a resurrection of all who have died and never had an opportunity sometime during the great tribulation? ........Or are you saying those that are still alive during the great tribulation will be given an opportunity?

This is the very first verse in The Bible that I think about every time these questions come up. 

John 1:9........" That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world."

John 1:9 does not say some men but it says "Every Man". 

We all know that John 1 is about The Word and we all certainly know who The Word is. We also know that The Word is The True Light that is also referring to Jesus Christ. 

The Word of God is way more than just scrolls and what later was put together as The Bible.


John 1:5........"  And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not."

We can go back for hundreds and thousands of years and as dark as things may have seemed "The Darkness" never has extinguish "The Light". (The Light, The Word, Jesus) was always there. 

Here is another verse that covers a lot I believe.

Deuteronomy 30:14........"But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it."

What is the gospel=The Good News?........."Was the gospel preached before Jesus was born into a flesh body?"............."Did Abraham hear the gospel?" ..........If he did, who taught him?

Galatians 3:8........"And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed."

God does not need us humans to spread his word out into the earth. But yes he uses humans to help spread his word out into this earth because we were created to "Image" him........"We are to be Imagers of God." We are to be many members in one body. 

Isaiah 55:8-11
For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.


For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.


For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater:


So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

We as humans living in this body composed of dust do not, and will not ever have all the answers that we seek to many questions.

ScaRZ wrote:

bordercollie wrote:

I think perhaps, that those people that have never known the Lord will be given the opportunity to change during the last part of the tribulation.   

Maybe I'm not understanding your thinking. Are you saying, you think there will be a resurrection of all who have died and never had an opportunity sometime during the great tribulation? ........Or are you saying those that are still alive during the great tribulation will be given an opportunity?

 No, I said perhaps . Those "still alive"  may "wake up  or as we used to say in the old days {see the Light}" when faced with all of that despair  and sadness during those last days..   
  I remember reading  something in 1 Peter- I believe, about Jesus going to the "prisons" in those 3 days after the cross ,and preaching to those that were lost without hearing the word. Maybe again for those souls who died not knowing of Him ?? I don't know... but believe the Lord would not subject those unknowers to hell without some sort of His Word being offered to them. . 
 As far as the people that already know Him,  I do know that I've had several wakeup calls to give me a good shaking when I was drifting off course . (such as the time I was trapped and almost squashed by a piece of heavy machinery)  These instances made me cry out to Him and my pleas were answered.   For the past many years, I talk to Him daily and thank Him often  .   Sometimes the answer is "No" but we must never loose our faith- That's what the evil one is trying his best to do to us.

No living thing can continue to live, unless other living things die. This is a law of nature in our physical reality.

One must pluck the weeds from the garden, or the flowers will be overcome and none will remain to bloom.

Our entire life is like a nanosecond in time from God's perspective.

Paul is a great example of how anyone can be a religious person and be blinded from truth.

Jesus Christ took away Paul's sight of seeing with only fleshly eyes, and once his sight was restored he could truly see for the first time.